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 Post subject: how would you rank their lines now?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 6:32 am 
the Floor Sweeping Hack with Golden Ears

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Its been a looooooooooooooong time since I considered buying any new gear from pg. Even though I was a fan I know I was not alone in the idea that I liked their old stuff better then their new probably since the Ti line partially because of my stubburn-ness(hard to believe I know). But the new lines I am happy to say have turned me around with me even questioning if the Elites are the best amp pg has put out now to date? I know we can't deny the list of componants is impressive, the looks are certainly not too shabby and the easter eggs inside are fun too and while most of us have not listened to them yet, how would your rank pg's amp lines from best-to-worst?



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 Post subject: Re: how would you rank their lines now?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 11:10 am 

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....cornmuffins are good


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 Post subject: Re: how would you rank their lines now?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 11:53 am 
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^^^^ Sounds like you've got a bone to pick with someone or something, either way the Elites are great amps unto themselves and compared to most of the mid-rate shit stuff that's being put out today to satisfy the low to mid end user who doesn't give a shit about SQ, just SPL. There's are many amps out that cost way more and may sound better, but each to his own opinion.



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 Post subject: Re: how would you rank their lines now?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 12:26 pm 
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smoothfidelity wrote:
ttocs wrote:
I know we can't deny the list of componants is impressive, the looks are certainly not too shabby and the easter eggs inside are fun too and while most of us have not listened to them yet, how would your rank pg's amp lines from best-to-worst?


Out of all the good points you mention about the new Elite amps, only one will affect sound. The others are moot.

Second; you can throw thousands of good parts into an amp, but board topology is going to make a bigger difference than anything else. Just because you see good parts doesn't mean the amp is the best thing in the world.


Whats it like in your world, have you got any special powers?



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 Post subject: Re: how would you rank their lines now?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 1:09 pm 

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...with butter


Last edited by smoothfidelity on Thu Feb 21, 2013 1:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: how would you rank their lines now?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 1:14 pm 
the Floor Sweeping Hack with Golden Ears

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I was always able to walk on water but I have noticed my speed has increased 3x now. Not sure if its the amps or my new diet though.

But seriously we can ignore the ass-clowns comments as he obviously has nothing to add to the phorum, every forum has its troll.

Maybe we should break it up into segments though as I know we have our cosmetic favs as well as our sq/spl favs and they are not always the same. I still love the old design of the zero point amps and they were certainly good power-houses but not sure I would stack them in the same relm as the M's smooth sounds.

As for the design on the elites and really all the new amps(pg and others making black square amps with/out plexi now) I kinda think they need something to break them up a bit myself. I have wondered if there was a way to light up the area under the plexi to show the insides off more or what kind of lights would allow the inside to be seen more.



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 Post subject: Re: how would you rank their lines now?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 4:36 pm 
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I like the profile of these new amps, just don't get why they used tinted plexi. For that reason more lights would be cool.



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 Post subject: Re: how would you rank their lines now?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 6:05 pm 
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the way i look at it is all pg amps sound like pg. now some can't do lower ohms some can't use 8volts plus, but they all have a special sound.
i would put the new amps vs zpa or ms amp any day im sure without knowing what unit it was what there would be a hard time to tell what amp is what. pg was ahead of the game back in the early 90's and things have not changed all that much on the sound end in years
now most of us love the ms amp for how they look old school classics(just like cars there are alot of car that can out run a old school car and still be able to turn corners..lol) than zpa for one mean amp way ahead of it time than the le amp because they are low number and look differnt.
im kinda sad to say most new amps all look the same and now that other have played the game and have ok parts also it comes down to price size and if you can have a better sound system than your friend
back in the day at least in calgary it was the brand you ran and how it sounded ---pg,rf,orion soundstream ect not how many watts and sure not what you spent but times have changed

ttocs you will not hear any differnce with your roaster 66 i would put money on it...



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 Post subject: Re: how would you rank their lines now?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 6:20 pm 
the Floor Sweeping Hack with Golden Ears

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I don't doubt that I would not be able to a-b the RSD and the elite lines but what it buys me is the ability to not wonder "what if" years down the road. Also allows me to tuch the LE amp back where it will stay safe.



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 Post subject: Re: how would you rank their lines now?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 7:29 pm 

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Back in the early 90's I had an M100 and M44, and they were the best amps I ever heard. At the time PG and PPI were the only brands I knew of that could handle stupidly low impedances. I never had the MS series, but I had and heard plenty of gear from other brands. Those amps were what brought me to seek out what Phoenix Gold is doing now, after having them 20 years ago.

Tomorrow morning in fact I'm taking my vehicle to have an Elite.5, 2 sets of Elite.65's and a Ti2 sub installed, primarily because I wanted to have an amp as good as or better than what I had 20 years ago. I'm going to reserve judgment on whether the new gear is better until I give it a good thrashing. However I find it very doubtful that 20 years from now I will look back as fondly on that Elite.5 as I do now on those M series amps.

I tend to think that no matter how good that system sounds when I get it this weekend I will always think that M series system was better, even if it really wasn't.



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 Post subject: Re: how would you rank their lines now?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 9:57 pm 
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Not sure how to rank old vs new, but I definitely like the new gear. I never owned any ms amps and only installed a few. First amps I owned were a m50 and m25, I remember thinking how great they were back then. Still love the m series til this day. Wasn't a huge fan of zx, ti, or zpa. I thought they were strong and clean, but I didnt get as much experience as the cheaper ones (qx at the time). Then came tantrum and the shop I worked at dropped pg (customer service issues). So no experience with rsd, octane, roadster, etc. But I have to say, when xmax subs were in production, they were the best subs on the market imo. Hard hitting, clean, and sexy. I would have to say that the ti2 subs closely mirror the xmax imo. As far as new vs old, technology has come a long way. Now you can get an amp that puts out the same power if not more than a zpa.5 in 1/3 of the space. I think one of the most alluring factors of pg, past and present, has always been the build quality and LE amps.



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 Post subject: Re: how would you rank their lines now?
PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 4:15 am 
the Floor Sweeping Hack with Golden Ears

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see I too can remember going to the store(prior to starting my career) and seeing those M-amps in all their gold glory as well. That is what got me thinking because with as great as they are/were the exclusivity that the price of them created was enough at the time to impress my 15 yr old ass as something that I would never be able to afford.... Now I just spent more on two amps then I ever did before for the new elite amps and it just got me thinking of how going to the store and seeing the price of those at 15 would still impress me. I started working when the ZX series was out and was happy to get to work with them, Ti and some RSD/tantrum, ect. The only M/ms series I got too work with were older amps that someone brought in.



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 Post subject: Re: how would you rank their lines now?
PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 5:40 am 
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Flicking through the latest PG catalogue I was thinking about your question 'How would you rank their lines now?' and struggled to come to any sort of conclusion, which in itself says something I guess. I know the lower end lines serve their purpose and the Elite line has great reviews, hell I have even bought a set of Elite.65 comps myself, will use bits in my wifes car, but so far no amps. Why havnt I bought an amp? Sure I would love one ,,, but am I lusting after one? No.... :|

Previous comments of spotting treasure nestling under a glass counter in the local audio shop sparked memories for me, these wildly expensive aesthetically beautiful exotic bits of kit, with their distinct styling and then racks of gorgeous accessories. Its no wonder so many of us got hooked. Sure I started with a Saphire amp hooked up with the cheaper line of RCAs and cables running a JL sub and Caliber UniQs. But I was back in the shop upgrading accessories to delicious Zeropoint ones when I was flush just to find an even more outrageous PG product had taken pride of place under that counter.

So where am I going with all of this waffle? as I am as pleased as the next PG enthusiast on their comeback and happy when I hear how good the products perform. But am I wowed by the desirability .... sadly not yet.

I guess thats not what you wanted to hear, wish I could answer differently.



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 Post subject: Re: how would you rank their lines now?
PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 6:38 am 
the Floor Sweeping Hack with Golden Ears

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I am not offended to hear your opinion, I asked for it and wanted to hear it.

Yea you remember the day when you walked into the shop, saw your first PG amp and heard the angels singing in chorus behind(WAAAAAAAAAAAH) you as you looked over it too huh? Yea I remember that day and wonder what else I might have become addicted too if I had not gone to the shop that day.



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 Post subject: Re: how would you rank their lines now?
PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 9:16 am 

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ttocs wrote:
Yea you remember the day when you walked into the shop, saw your first PG amp and heard the angels singing in chorus behind(WAAAAAAAAAAAH) you as you looked over it too huh? Yea I remember that day and wonder what else I might have become addicted too if I had not gone to the shop that day.


LOL I had that experience too. For me though, while I think the older amps looked better, and are probably as good as or better sounding than the new (I have a new Elite amp, and it's close, but the verdict is still out), I am at a point in my life that I don't want to have to fiddle with it. I don't have time to be a DIY'er anymore. I don't want an amp that I need to have recapped, or have to switch out periodically because a 20 year old component reached it's life expectancy. For that reason, I personally wouldn't use the old amps knowing that the new Elites are as good as or better than the old. In my opinion life's too short to have some epic components sitting in a closet waiting for me to find time to install them. That's just me though. Me, working 60 hours a week, 6 days a week most of the time, and having a 2 year old that wants Daddy time, and a wife that likes her attention too. There is nowhere in there for time to fiddle with a car audio system.

I love, love, love the old PG amps, the M series in particular, but for me it's a nostalgic thing only. If I was single and worked a more "normal" job, things might be different, but as it is, Elite is where it's at for me, and I'll gladly pay a man/team to install it even though I could do it myself if I had the time.

But yes, I do agree with PhuckinGood. The new amps aren't much to look at compared to the old, but that's everyone, not just PG. It was a different era back then. The PG amps looked great, but so did the PPI Art Series, Soundstream Reference series, even the Fosgate Punch series had those round endcaps that gave them a distinctive look. A lot of other brand's amps looked awesome too, I could go on and on. I blame it on the lack of high level competition circuits these days, and lack of magazines featuring installs compared to old. Everything was sexy looking back in the hey day of IASCA and USAC competitions, and when installs got featured in CA&E, Auto Sound and Security, and the other magazines. It's just a different era imo.



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 Post subject: Re: how would you rank their lines now?
PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 6:25 pm 
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ttocs wrote:
I don't doubt that I would not be able to a-b the RSD and the elite lines but what it buys me is the ability to not wonder "what if" years down the road. Also allows me to tuch the LE amp back where it will stay safe.

I can say for certain the there is a very noticeable difference between the elite and the RSD. No question about it.
On my ti6's they really lit up with the elite.4. The elite.4 doesn't even break sweat at the same level as my rsd500.4 or ti500.5. I've seen lots of guys have the new elite amps now. But very few have actually installed one yet. I've been using mine for a month now and there is no other amp I would change it for. The elite is big for a reason.


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 Post subject: Re: how would you rank their lines now?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 1:38 am 

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PhuckinGood wrote:
Flicking through the latest PG catalogue I was thinking about your question 'How would you rank their lines now?' and struggled to come to any sort of conclusion, which in itself says something I guess. I know the lower end lines serve their purpose and the Elite line has great reviews, hell I have even bought a set of Elite.65 comps myself, will use bits in my wifes car, but so far no amps. Why havnt I bought an amp? Sure I would love one ,,, but am I lusting after one? No.... :|

Previous comments of spotting treasure nestling under a glass counter in the local audio shop sparked memories for me, these wildly expensive aesthetically beautiful exotic bits of kit, with their distinct styling and then racks of gorgeous accessories. Its no wonder so many of us got hooked. Sure I started with a Saphire amp hooked up with the cheaper line of RCAs and cables running a JL sub and Caliber UniQs. But I was back in the shop upgrading accessories to delicious Zeropoint ones when I was flush just to find an even more outrageous PG product had taken pride of place under that counter.

So where am I going with all of this waffle? as I am as pleased as the next PG enthusiast on their comeback and happy when I hear how good the products perform. But am I wowed by the desirability .... sadly not yet.

I guess thats not what you wanted to hear, wish I could answer differently.


Spot on.


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