Need Help Adjusting Xenon 1200.1

SlinkComa · Post by **SlinkComa** » Mon Aug 02, 2010 10:38 pm

Hi all my name is Alex and I am a complete noob when it comes to car audio installation and I need some help. I have a PG Xenon 1200.1 to push my 12'' JL Audio W7 in the ProWedge enclosure. I also have a Memphis 16 volt line driver that adjusts from 0-20db. Where I'm having problems is adjusting and tuning the amp and line driver to get the most out of the W7. I don't know where the input sensitivity, twin-t bass EQ, lowpass crossover, and the subsonic filter should be set at. Here is the link to the owners manual for the xenon 1200.1. For anyone who understands the technical data. The specs are on page 3.

http://download.phoenixphorum.com/Manua ... manual.pdf

I have the owners manual for the W7, but it only suggests the settings for the JL Audio 1000/1 so it wasn't much help. So if anyone here as some insight on this it would be a huge help.

Post by **AVICJR** » Thu Aug 05, 2010 2:36 pm

Here's a couple of "reads" for you. Each individual system installs are adjusted/set differently according to many different variables, including and most importantly you!

Start with this info below and then we can help you narrow more down later.

http://phoenixphorum.com/xenon-faq-vt183.html

http://phoenixphorum.com/basic-system-a ... vt180.html

Stryker · Post by **Stryker** » Thu Aug 05, 2010 3:24 pm

This is in the completely WRONG section.

Post by **ttocs** » Thu Aug 05, 2010 3:43 pm

Stryker wrote:This is in the completely WRONG section.

roughly translated it means welcome to the forum

.....

Post by **smgreen20** » Thu Aug 05, 2010 6:15 pm

AND QUITE YELLING!!!!!!

Welcome

Stryker · Post by **Stryker** » Thu Aug 05, 2010 7:54 pm

Uhh ya sorry. Welcome

SlinkComa · Post by **SlinkComa** » Fri Aug 06, 2010 10:50 am

Like I said, im back to being a noob when it comes to the car audio scene, including forums lol. Thanks for the warm welcome everybody

So bear with me and my noobyness as I try to get some help from you guys.

jbob0124 · Post by **jbob0124** » Fri Aug 06, 2010 12:12 pm

Welcome to the phorum, have a look at the links AVICJR posted, they are helpful. With the line driver, you will want to follow the same method found in the second link for setting up the amps.

SlinkComa · Post by **SlinkComa** » Fri Aug 06, 2010 8:39 pm

Thank you AVICJR and jbob. I looked at the two links you posted and they were a huge help. I followed the steps and I think I am close to having the amp where it should be. The only question now is, it's kind of hard to describe, but when I turn the volume up it sounds like the cone on the sub is popping, kind of like I'm pushing it too hard but I've heard a few W7's and I know I'm not anywhere near pushing the sub too hard. I'm still being easy on it because it's brand new. So is it because of the recent adjustments on the amp? It didnt do it before I adjusted it, I dunno maybe I have the sensitivity too low?

Post by **ttocs** » Fri Aug 06, 2010 9:05 pm

sounds like you are pushing it into clipping which = bad bad bad. A meter will not tell you if it is clipping, try backing off the gain just a tad until it goes away.

In this case with a line driver and an amp I really do not think a meter is the right tool to do this. I just ordered a pocket size oscilliscope to tune my system since I added an EQ215ix. When I am done with it, if there is anyone on here that would like to use it to tune their system the best way to do it let me know and we can work it out. It is small enough to ship with the cd needed to do it easily.

eulogious · Post by **eulogious** » Sat Aug 07, 2010 1:02 am

ttocs wrote:sounds like you are pushing it into clipping which = bad bad bad. A meter will not tell you if it is clipping, try backing off the gain just a tad until it goes away.

I second this motion. You are pushing the amp to hard, and can/will damage the speaker if you keep it up! Back the gains down, and you should be fine

Post by **ttocs** » Sat Aug 07, 2010 1:26 am

maybe you got some of your numbers wrong in your calculations to find what your meter should read. Post them up here and someone that believes it is a good idea to use a meter will check them.

SlinkComa · Post by **SlinkComa** » Thu Aug 12, 2010 12:25 am

ttocs and eulogious, clipping definitely sounds like the best word to describe the issue. As far as the adjustments, you guys are mentioning the gains on the amp and the line driver. The line driver itself only has one adjustment and that is labeled as the gain, but as far as the amp goes, it has four adjustment screws (input sensitivity, twin-T bass EQ, lowpass crossover, and subsonic filter) and none of them are labeled as the gains. Also you mentioned an o-scope, but I never used one when I tweaked the adjustments so it sounds like that is a must to keep everything running smooth and error free. I'm still learning the technical aspects, and with the money I just dumped into it I definitely don't want to screw anything up. You guys have been a huge help and I really appreciate it. I'll take and use any advice you guys have to offer. So which adjustments do I need to back off on the amp to eliminate the clipping? Also the sub hits great on the lower tones but it's pretty weak with the higher bass tones, can you give me some insight on how I can get the higher tones to hit harder?

SlinkComa · Post by **SlinkComa** » Thu Aug 12, 2010 12:27 am

And sorry for the late response, been having connection issues with Comcast (no surprise there), I'm definitely making the switch to Fios when it's in my area

If I can't get my hands on an oscilloscope, is there another way I can properly tune this, or is it a must that I use an oscilloscope? I could take the easy way out and take it to a car audio shop and have them do it for 25 bucks, but I'd like to learn so I can save the cash for an optima yellow top. Either way I'll take your advice. Thanks again all for helping me out with this.

holmis · Post by **holmis** » Thu Aug 12, 2010 12:57 am

Turn the "input sens" all the way down down ..... Then turn "gain" up on line driver untill the amp clips again, then down so the clipping goes away.
If there is no clipping at full "gain" on the line driver, only then you should turn up "input sens" on the amp.

The volume on your HU should be at 3/4 of full.

Be aware that this metod can blow your speakers if the amp i way bigger than what the speakers can take...

Thats the basic adjustment....

SlinkComa · Post by **SlinkComa** » Thu Aug 12, 2010 1:18 am

Thanks holmis. I'll give that a shot and see if I can get the system sounding the way it should. Which adjustments would be considered the gains on the amp? Also when setting the bass, I read to use the twin-t bass EQ sparingly because for every 3db of boost requires double the power at 45hz. This is where I have to find the right balance of bass boost between the HU, line driver, and the bass EQ on the amp itself so I'm probably going to need some experienced advice on the order for setting the bass.

I have the amp pushing a W7, so the wattage between the two match up real nice. It has all of the power the W7 needs and then some, so it's a pretty good match.

holmis · Post by **holmis** » Thu Aug 12, 2010 1:32 am

SlinkComa wrote:Thanks holmis. I'll give that a shot and see if I can get the system sounding the way it should. Which adjustments would be considered the gains on the amp? Also when setting the bass, I read to use the twin-t bass EQ sparingly because for every 3db of boost requires double the power at 45hz. This is where I have to find the right balance of bass boost between the HU, line driver, and the bass EQ on the amp itself

The gain on the amp is the input sens.
When adjusting bass levels, ist smart to turn all bass adjustments all the way down, & work your way up.... Its a lot of things that come into play when adjusting .
I like to have all my bass levels & use a LPL to have control of the level i front. The HU runs flat & all adjustmenst i done at the amp end when it comes to bass levels.

But thats a personal pref...

//Asle

SlinkComa · Post by **SlinkComa** » Thu Aug 12, 2010 2:02 am

Oh okay the input sensitivity is the gain, cool thanks. I think I'm going to end up buying the LPL. Makes life real simple when it comes to adjusting the bass, especially when you have three separate components that contribute to the levels of bass. When I was tweaking the HU EQ, I found that increasing the bass boost actually made it closer to sounding like a real W7, clear and crisp. It was sounding pretty sloppy before, so I'm guessing it's going to take me a while to get everything in perfect sync. I'm glad I was told about the clipping now before I did any damage to the sub.

dwnrodeo · Post by **dwnrodeo** » Thu Aug 12, 2010 3:18 am

SlinkComa wrote:Thanks holmis. I'll give that a shot and see if I can get the system sounding the way it should. Which adjustments would be considered the gains on the amp? Also when setting the bass, I read to use the twin-t bass EQ sparingly because for every 3db of boost requires double the power at 45hz. This is where I have to find the right balance of bass boost between the HU, line driver, and the bass EQ on the amp itself so I'm probably going to need some experienced advice on the order for setting the bass.

I have the amp pushing a W7, so the wattage between the two match up real nice. It has all of the power the W7 needs and then some, so it's a pretty good match.

I would personally keep the bass boost turned all of the way down. Like you mentioned, 3db of bass boost requires double the power at 45hz and that means drawing a lot more current. If you properly adjust your gains, you shouldn't need bass boost on the amp or the HU. The LPL is a good tool to attenuate the bass rather than boosting it via the amp or HU.

SlinkComa · Post by **SlinkComa** » Thu Aug 12, 2010 4:07 am

It definitely draws a lot of current. Well I will zero out my HU and the bass boost and tweak the gains until it's where it should be. So really all I need to do is tweak the input sensitivity on the amp and the gain on my line driver right? Also do you know which adjustment out of the four is in control of the higher bass tones? Or will adjusting the gains take care of that as well? It hits good on the low tones, but it's pretty weak on the higher bass tones and I know for a fact the W7 can be doing a much better job in that department. Now I just have to find a place where I can turn it up and not get a notice on my door. That's what sucks about living in a town home/apartment complex.

holmis · Post by **holmis** » Thu Aug 12, 2010 4:20 am

If you need the bass to go higher you adjust the Lowpass crossover. higher freq. the sub get. Iwould try click 14 first (thats 68Hz). This you have to ty either way. Depends on the box & subwoofer setup..

SlinkComa · Post by **SlinkComa** » Thu Aug 12, 2010 4:34 am

Awesome, now I get it. Zero out my HU and turn down the bass boost, adjust the gain on the line driver and the input sensitivity on the amp, turn it up about 3/4, wait until it clips and then back off the gains a little until the clipping is eliminated. Then tweak the lowpass crossover to bring out the higher bass tones. Ill give these a shot and hopefully if it stops raining today get it adjusted before lunch.

holmis · Post by **holmis** » Thu Aug 12, 2010 6:16 am

SlinkComa wrote:Awesome, now I get it. Zero out my HU and turn down the bass boost, adjust the gain on the line driver and the input sensitivity on the amp, turn it up about 3/4, wait until it clips and then back off the gains a little until the clipping is eliminated. Then tweak the lowpass crossover to bring out the higher bass tones. Ill give these a shot and hopefully if it stops raining today get it adjusted before lunch.

Allmost....

Adj your lowpass crossover first at a normal hearing level before adjusting gain ...

- 3/4 volume on HU with gain on linjedriver down, amp gain down. EQ flat on HU
-Turn linjedriver up untill system clips (Either linjedriver clipping or amp clipping).
-If clipping turn linjedriver down untill clipping is gone. No adj to gain on amp..
-If no clipping, you can start turning up amp gain untill clip & then down a bit. Attension not too blow your speaker if the amp is way mor powerful than the speakers...

SlinkComa · Post by **SlinkComa** » Thu Aug 12, 2010 10:09 am

Thats exactly what I needed. Some step by step instructions. Thanks again for the help. Ill give it a shot and let u guys know how it turned out. Holmis you mentioned when adjusting the gain on the line driver to turn it up until it starts clipping, now the only way to identify clipping is the distortion coming out of the sub right?

holmis · Post by **holmis** » Thu Aug 12, 2010 1:49 pm

SlinkComa wrote:Thats exactly what I needed. Some step by step instructions. Thanks again for the help. Ill give it a shot and let u guys know how it turned out. Holmis you mentioned when adjusting the gain on the line driver to turn it up until it starts clipping, now the only way to identify clipping is the distortion coming out of the sub right?

I dont know your line driver... On the Phoenix Gold ones there are a led that indicates clipping, so its very easy to see. On yours I dont know...

If there is nothing to indicate this, i would try 3/4 on the line driver too first, then more & more...

//Asle