Power Wire

[Phoenixcolt]

Besides the fusing, is there a difference between the Tsunami AMP850BL amp power kit and the AMP04BL?

http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_146 ... 850BL.html
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_226 ... P04BL.html


I will be setting a little something up in the spring and want to stick with the 4 gauge I already have run in the car. I currently have the AMP850BL kit.

I think all I will need to do is change to an ANL type fuse rather than an AGU. Right now I have an AGU 60 amp fuse, would probably upgrade to a 100 to 150 amp ANL fuse since I will be running two Xenon amps. This would still be under the 1600 watts or so that the heavier duty Tsunami kit claims to allow, so if I fuse it similarly, it doesn't seem like it would be a problem. I don't see any other differences between the kits.

[kg1961]

they look the same other than the fuses but if your going to run a x200.4 and a x1200.1 you will need zero gauge, not 4g they each need 4 gauge so 2 or 0 gauge is needed
very nice amps love them both let me know if you ever sell them
mike

[ttocs]

only difference I see id the fuses.

[dvnt88]

they look the same other than the fuses but if your going to run a x200.4 and a x1200.1 you will need zero gauge, not 4g they each need 4 gauge so 2 or 0 gauge is needed
very nice amps love them both let me know if you ever sell them
mike

You can run 4g wire as each amp has 2 power / ground connection points , which would equal your 0g current / power draw and is a nice feature on both the amps.

[kg1961]

they look the same other than the fuses but if your going to run a x200.4 and a x1200.1 you will need zero gauge, not 4g they each need 4 gauge so 2 or 0 gauge is needed
very nice amps love them both let me know if you ever sell them
mike

You can run 4g wire as each amp has 2 power / ground connection points , which would equal your 0g current / power draw and is a nice feature on both the amps.

yes but im sure you can't get the needs of the amp off one single power wire off the batt. you need zero to a fuse block than feed all 4 4gauge if not you will starve the amps

[Phoenixcolt]

I was only planning on taking advantage of 1000 watts of the X1200.1 to power my RSdc102, and I am powering RSd components with the X200.4 which I wouldn't be able to throw 200 per channel at anyway (2 channels to the midranges, and two channels through the passive crossovers to the tweets). I would think at most I will be using 100 watts per channel of the 200.4.

Would I still be starving the amps if I set the gains to the wattages I mentioned above and use one run of 4 gauge with the proper fusing?

I am trying to avoid upgrading the power wire because it runs through a grommet by the fusebox and through the driver's side fender and it will not be easy to run 1/0 that way, maybe not even possible as there is not a lot of room under the runners or by the fusebox.

What if I run another line of 4 gauge so each amp has their own power wire from the battery? I can manage that and it should be safe unless PG's recommendation of minimum 4 gauge per amp is an irresponsible one.

I could easily ground with 2 or 1/0 in the trunk area.

[Bfowler]

is this in the wrx? i seem to remember a large plastic clip on the drivers side that is easy to remove and drill out for larger guage cable.

even run conservatively, i can't recommend running those 2 amps on a single 4awg. i even run a single > then 4awg when i do x600.1's and 100.2's together in an install

[dvnt88]

they look the same other than the fuses but if your going to run a x200.4 and a x1200.1 you will need zero gauge, not 4g they each need 4 gauge so 2 or 0 gauge is needed
very nice amps love them both let me know if you ever sell them
mike

You can run 4g wire as each amp has 2 power / ground connection points , which would equal your 0g current / power draw and is a nice feature on both the amps.

yes but im sure you can't get the needs of the amp off one single power wire off the batt. you need zero to a fuse block than feed all 4 4gauge if not you will starve the amps

No ..I meant run 0g wire from the battery to a distro block or 2 and run the 4g from there . I have done this in the past with the same 2 amps and never had a problem giving them what they need.

[Phoenixcolt]

is this in the wrx? i seem to remember a large plastic clip on the drivers side that is easy to remove and drill out for larger guage cable.

even run conservatively, i can't recommend running those 2 amps on a single 4awg. i even run a single > then 4awg when i do x600.1's and 100.2's together in an install

Understandable, I am not the type to risk it, just prepping myself for what to expect.


So if I run two separate strands of 4 gauge from the battery to the amps, are you saying that is still not recommended?

[Phoenixcolt]

is this in the wrx? i seem to remember a large plastic clip on the drivers side that is easy to remove and drill out for larger guage cable.

even run conservatively, i can't recommend running those 2 amps on a single 4awg. i even run a single > then 4awg when i do x600.1's and 100.2's together in an install

Yeah it's a 2009 wrx, but I can't picture a clip and I spent quite a while under there trying to run the 4 gauge. Just a large grommet next to the fuse panel. Perhaps I can run bigger gauge through there but getting it through the fender is the real trick. I ended up denting the fender from the inside last time so I have a little outward dent on the exterior, maybe the stiffer large gauge will be easier.

I have seen a couple different strands of 1/0, PG's 1/0 was pretty tightly wound wasn't it? Like not a huge diameter? I had some 1/0 ground in my old car by Monster and it was easily an inch or a little more in diameter, I can't work with that, but PG's might be alright...or whatever I can find that is a similar diameter.

[Bfowler]

is this in the wrx? i seem to remember a large plastic clip on the drivers side that is easy to remove and drill out for larger guage cable.

even run conservatively, i can't recommend running those 2 amps on a single 4awg. i even run a single > then 4awg when i do x600.1's and 100.2's together in an install

Understandable, I am not the type to risk it, just prepping myself for what to expect.


So if I run two separate strands of 4 gauge from the battery to the amps, are you saying that is still not recommended?

oh, maybe i misunderstood. a 4awg each will be ok if you are nice to them

[Bfowler]

the clip i'm thinking of is right below the brake booster. its very hard to see from the engine side,
found this too:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthr ... ?t=1704412

[Phoenixcolt]

is this in the wrx? i seem to remember a large plastic clip on the drivers side that is easy to remove and drill out for larger guage cable.

even run conservatively, i can't recommend running those 2 amps on a single 4awg. i even run a single > then 4awg when i do x600.1's and 100.2's together in an install

Understandable, I am not the type to risk it, just prepping myself for what to expect.


So if I run two separate strands of 4 gauge from the battery to the amps, are you saying that is still not recommended?

oh, maybe i misunderstood. a 4awg each will be ok if you are nice to them

Initially I wanted to use one run of 4, but since that didn't sound safe, I later mentioned running 2 4 gauge wires from battery to each amp.

What is the smallest diameter I can get 1/0 in?

[kg1961]

2- 4gauge would be the same size as a zero gauge IMO. yes there will be less wire in the 4 but more rubber should be very very close. looking at the pocture that guy is running 0 or 2 gauge in his set up

[Phoenixcolt]

the clip i'm thinking of is right below the brake booster. its very hard to see from the engine side,
found this too:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthr ... ?t=1704412

That is a great write up, my power wire running didn't go so smooth, I was pissed when I gave the fender a little outward dent. I remember reading that people were running through the firewall there but when I tried it, I was worried about the sound deadener so I went the other route.

If I get this way to work, it would be way nicer to run the wire under the seat and the carpet to the trunk.

[Phoenixcolt]

2- 4gauge would be the same size as a zero gauge IMO. yes there will be less wire in the 4 but more rubber should be very very close. looking at the pocture that guy is running 0 or 2 gauge in his set up

Yeah I saw that, I am going to revisit the firewall power wire route in the spring I think.

[HifiDon]

I would run a single 2 awg cable to a distro block & 4 awg to amplifiers. The cost of running TWO 4awg with each having separate fuse holders would cost alot more...

ALSO! Not all cable wires are created equal!! You take that tsunami & compare to a stinger or JL audio wire and you will understand why they cost more. Copper is not cheap! Yes the OUTER rubber sleeve looks like 4 awg, but the amount of copper inside is equal to a 7-8 awg.

I've collected MANY samples working in retail & I used to show my customers WHY the cheap kits are.....cheaper in price..

So run a GOOD quality (Stinger, JL Audio) 2 awg kit to your amps.. If you really want to compare, Go buy several small 4inch pieces from your local stores.. Then compare them, you will never buy cheap wire again!

[ttocs]

I have seem pics of wires cross cut and put next to each other and its funny to see the cheap wires insulation is almost 1/4-3/8 thick. With those amps you do not want to cheap out on the wire.....

[HifiDon]

Also when installing, make sure you go THROUGH the firewall (not door jam) & you use a GROMMET if it's near metal... Going through a plastic blank panel is ok. try to use grommet anyway.. also keep your fuse holder within 12" of battery & you have near perfect connections at the fuse holder. If not,.....it WILL melt!! Seen dozens because of this!

Good luck & i'm sure you will do fine... Proper installation is HALF the battle to a good sound system!

[scottn29]

they look the same other than the fuses but if your going to run a x200.4 and a x1200.1 you will need zero gauge, not 4g they each need 4 gauge so 2 or 0 gauge is needed
very nice amps love them both let me know if you ever sell them
mike

You can run 4g wire as each amp has 2 power / ground connection points , which would equal your 0g current / power draw and is a nice feature on both the amps.

2 4 gauge wires do not equal 1/0, nor can 2 4 gauges wires handle the flow of 1/0. Would be closer to 2.5-2.75 X 4 gauge to compare to 1/0. Just like 2 8 gauge wires do not equal a 4 gauge.

[Bfowler]

they look the same other than the fuses but if your going to run a x200.4 and a x1200.1 you will need zero gauge, not 4g they each need 4 gauge so 2 or 0 gauge is needed
very nice amps love them both let me know if you ever sell them
mike

You can run 4g wire as each amp has 2 power / ground connection points , which would equal your 0g current / power draw and is a nice feature on both the amps.

2 4 gauge wires do not equal 1/0, nor can 2 4 gauges wires handle the flow of 1/0. Would be closer to 2.5-2.75 X 4 gauge to compare to 1/0. Just like 2 8 gauge wires do not equal a 4 gauge.

This^

for further explanation

the american standard for gauges is the 1/X where 1 is an inch, and X is the guage and that fraction is the diameter

so 8awg should be 1/8th of an inch think (just wire, not insulation)

so if we use the perimeter of a circle formula (becasue most currant travels on the surface of cable) 2piR

for 4 awg
we get 2pi*.125= .785 perimeter inches *2 (for each cable) and we get 1.57 inches

for 1/0
2pi*.5=3.14 perimeter inches. so 1/0 is actually closer to 4 4awg's (obviously there is going to be some loss for resistance but you can see 1/0 is > then 2 4awg)

[kg1961]

I know it not the same im saying the the out side of the powers with 2 4gauge will almost be the same a single zero gauge wire
im talking about the hole need to be cut in the fire wall. i understand the amount of wire or the amount of current they can hold

[Phoenixcolt]

Hey guys I emailed Sonicelectronix a question about the power wire diameter measurements and they didn't have them but did bring to my attention that the Monster 1/0, because I mentioned to them I have owned Monster and another brand of 1/0 in the past and the Monster was much thicker, is a lot more thick because Monster is an AWG company. I was not aware of this but AWG pertains to the actual copper in a wire. AWG 1/0 means there is actually 1/0 of copper instead of non AWG which would be 1/0 between the copper and sheath.

This was also a difference between the two kits I had questions on in the first post. Besides the type of fusing, one of those 4 gauge kits was AWG and one was not.

I know we went on to discuss other things, and I will definitely be upgrading my gauge, but I was glad to learn this and wanted to share the knowledge with people who stumble on this down the road.

[HifiDon]

That is the main difference in determining the amount of copper in the wire. If the company REALLY goes by the AWG standard then you should be ok..
BUT!

I've had customers bring me CHEAP amp kits in that said "AWG" on the box & I knew something wasn't right....

One time the "AWG" stood for something else, i had to look everywhere on the box & I wish I could remember what it stood for...but can't remember. NOT American Wire Gauge...

The most common was they ran a piece of insulation in the MIDDLE of the copper to make the copper SEEM bigger... To the regular eye, it was alot of copper...This was by far the best sample wire I had collected! But it also said "AWG" on the box. Of course these were china kits & didn't seem to care, just wanted to rip customers off...

Like i've said earlier... Buy from a good company.. I have used MANY & EVERY kind of wire out there. Stinger & JL are more expensive...yes.. BUT it is great quality wire & all of the fuse blocks, terminals are what make the price worth it.
I have had my 2ga JL kit for 6 years..4 cars.. I keep pulling it out of one car, to go in another. It is flexible, terminal blocks won't melt/corrode & they provide a EXCELLENT connection to the wire...

Not to start another debate but try to buy the kit from your local store... Take a print-out of the amp kit with a FAIR price & present it to them..(Apples to apples...Not a pyramid kit to JL) They might be able to help you out... Without Brick & Mortar stores, none of these good brands will survive... Also I do not work for ANY store, manufacture but did for 6yrs... Just a enthusiast like everyone on this forum

[ttocs]

if they bought it from a store that would mean they would almost have to pay retail?