Phoenix Gold Phorum

Hey bro´s

Opened up my PG Outlaw, took some pics of the caps and board.

It looks ok, just wanna know if anyone can tell me if these caps have been replaced?

I bought the Amp used in 2001, hooked up for bout 50 hours since then.. never pushed this amp to its limit´s.

REPLACE THEM...If they have "HF" or "HFZ" then you need to replace them ASAP. Now the rail caps could use a little help themselves but people usually damage those when trying to remove them so unless your (or your "to go to" guy) knows exactly what their doing otherwise they can damage the though hole vias... (been stated over and over on this site).


I got pics of a Bandit that caught fire, good thing it wasn't that bad of a fire because it didn't cause any damage to the chassis. I went ahead and replace the board for the owner.


BTW never go off of by "looks okay"...otherwise you'll end up with a burnt up amplifier. Once you've remove those caps you will see that they have in deed leaked.

trickyricky wrote:REPLACE THEM...If they have "HF" or "HFZ" then you need to replace them ASAP. Now the rail caps could use a little help themselves but people usually damage those when trying to remove them so unless your (or your "to go to" guy) knows exactly what their doing otherwise they can damage the though hole vias... (been stated over and over on this site).


I got pics of a Bandit that caught fire, good thing it wasn't that bad of a fire because it didn't cause any damage to the chassis. I went ahead and replace the board for the owner.


BTW never go off of by "looks okay"...otherwise you'll end up with a burnt up amplifier. Once you've remove those caps you will see that they have in deed leaked.

Thanks Tricky.

it was in my mind to get this done, but now it gonna be done for sure.

My Electronics repair guy should have this under control. Thanks for the info though.

I agree with trickyricky.... take the 9 ps caps out of the amp ASAP.

you can leave the big railcaps in, they look fine.........

you can even put in 4 ps caps in the m50 section...normally they will fit if they are 32mm high.....

this is a do today, don't wait until tomorrow job, unless you want you're outlaw to end like you're powergrid...............

Hey guy´s
First of all, thanks for the "push" to get my amp done ( recapped )

Just a Quick update.

ALL 9 Caps leaked.. got them replaced with new ones, half physical size ??.. but same specs! Believe that electronic parts are becoming smaller and smaller..

The 4700uf was in perfect condition.

The board was dirty and got cleaned up also, so now i will install the amp again, untill the 2x 600Ti arrives from kg1961.

The Scandinavian Custom motor show is 2-4th May, and im gonna present PG, and take home the BIG ONE 1st place for sure!!

NOOOooo, You should of got same physical size with a higher rating capacitance. Heck sometimes even 18mm wide caps fit in the power supply as long as they are below 30mm in height/lenght.

What about the rail caps, where they the same type (snap in, 30-35mm diameter?)..



For the power supply filter caps I get 25v 4700uf or 3900uf and for the rails I try to stick with the same voltage but get as much capacitance as I can.

Tricky, what is the benefit of the larger capacitance? I replaced my caps with the new larger ones per the forums general recommendation, but what does this do for me or my system?
Corty, please excuse my thread jack.

More capacitance means more energy stored. So when your amp requires a larger power surge it will have more energy stored and have a smoother draw on your cars electrical system.

Think of it is way, the current draw that your amp has on the car is not constant...it goes up and down with the music. Louder notes require more current. Since it's for very short intervals, there's no need to always supply the high current, but the caps store energy to hopefully cut down on the short burst draws. When you increase the capacitance all you do is increase the storage space. It never hurts to add a little capacitance.

Especially when you have the space. I remember a M50 I got a while back (non working) and someone replaced the rail caps with 18mm diameter x 25mm long caps that where the right voltage but the capacitance was about a quarter of what the original was...lol. You should of seen it, it just looked WRONG!!

So you could accomplish the same with an external cap

quickrip wrote:So you could accomplish the same with an external cap

Sure, as long as the wires/cables are SHORT and there isn't a fuse in between the amp and cap.

Well that's what caps were all about in the 90s. The problem with those is that 1 farad or larger draw so much extra current that it's not really a benefit. Increasing the internal caps is beter than original, but not going to draw so much extra current that it defeats the purpose.

Capacitors don't draw current, they store charge. This is basic electronics.

I don't want to argue the pros and cons of them, but I just want to clarify that stating they "draw so much extra current" is highly misleading, and false.

Eric D wrote:Capacitors don't draw current, they store charge. This is basic electronics.

I don't want to argue the pros and cons of them, but I just want to clarify that stating they "draw so much extra current" is highly misleading, and false.

We had an argument over at DIYMA over caps, lol. So I know where your going with the "I don't want to argue" part.


Yes, Eric is correct they DO NOT draw current...once PROPERLY charged (that means through a 10-33 ohm resistor) they will no longer "draw so much extra current".

Now if you short a cap out (drop the voltage to zero) then try to straight attach it to any battery or supply IT WILL ARC and SPARK lol that's because IT IS drawing current VERY VERY fast and a lot of it depending on the caps size and characteristics. But once charged correctly and once at 12.6v it will no longer pull current.

And also you cannot substitute an amps power supply or rail caps.

If you remove the power supply caps, the amp might work a while at low power levels. But the power supply would be starved for current because it would be pulling high frequency current through the filtering coil. And a coil acts as a large impedance at high frequencies.

If you remove the large rail caps then the unfiltered current from the power suplly would probably just fry the amplifier stage.

All an external cap does is further filter noise from the 12V power wire and to some extent it can help band aid a weak power system (alt + battery + power wires)

trickyricky wrote:NOOOooo, You should of got same physical size with a higher rating capacitance. Heck sometimes even 18mm wide caps fit in the power supply as long as they are below 30mm in height/lenght.

What about the rail caps, where they the same type (snap in, 30-35mm diameter?)..



For the power supply filter caps I get 25v 4700uf or 3900uf and for the rails I try to stick with the same voltage but get as much capacitance as I can.

DAMN....

Well.. i did install the outlaw.. and the M100 has no output, but lights up in Gren!

took it out, replaced it with my 500.4Ti from Drock.. ( The show is on Friday )..
Called another AMP doctor, and told him about it, and he will take care of it.. replace the caps once again with physical same size!

Tricky: What would you recommend for the Caps instead of 2200uf 16v regular size?

Use 5,600uF 16V caps. 16V is plenty, and I think 5,600uF is the largest you will find that fits.

well.. got some good news today.

The caps is changed and upgraded to 3300uf 25v same physical size. ( panasonic caps )

the main input entrence in M100 amp was toasted caused by the Tantrum fire ( burned out 10 Farad cap )..

So now this baby is back running again.

Thanks to Munk AMP doctor in DK!

That's good to hear. Pics?

What series did you go with? Just curious about the ripple current. Shouldn't matter too much.

Panasonic (FC, FM, FR would be my choices). The FC has the same color sleeves and lettering as the originals.

trickyricky wrote:Panasonic (FC, FM, FR would be my choices). The FC has the same color sleeves and lettering as the originals.

Pictures will be uploaded later, when the amp is received again from MUNK amp doctor..

Then i will provide info and new pictures.

Imagine, i won the Scandinavian I.C.E contest with 500.4Ti for mid´s and tweet´s ! .. ( normally Outlaw for this setup )