Phoenix Gold Phorum

I'm running 2 elite d4s on an elite.1 amp(3100 watt mono) among focal mids and highs.
Daily listening, pissing old people and soccer moms off (I'm in central Florida)
I listen to bass heavy music ($uicideboy$, lil wyte, and some edm trap)
Ran the system for the past two months no problem. Today I'm running errands, and I notice a burning smell about 15 seconds before the amp went into protect and the subs kicked off. Pulled over and smoke was BILLOWING out of the port. How screwed am I?
A legit shop (which Phoenix gold and focal are the house brands) installed, made the box, so I'm not worried about warranty.
Just want to know how to avoid this problem in the future.
After shop calibrated my amp, I haven't touched the settings. RMD rarely goes below 12.0 during heavy bass.
Stinger batteries, Ohio generator alternator(300 amp)

well power doesnt kill subs.......clipping does.......

ive ran all types of speakers w double the rated power and never fried a coil. if the amp went into protect mode then the gains were set wrong. the elite series are really awesome amps and the elite subs are pretty good.

so im confident someone setup ur tuning totally incorrect.....let alone you prob have had your hu turned up into the clipping range also......

go see the shop and haggle it out with them

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

That is my experience too, distortion kill subwoofers, clean power dosen`t.

phonixx wrote:That is my experience too, distortion kill subwoofers, clean power dosen`t.

Well if the distortion you're talking about is clipping then yes. 1% distortion or even 5% distortion is not going to hurt a subwoofer.

And clean power can kill a sub, too much clean power will ALWAYS kill a sub that is rated for much less power. A 500watt subwoofer will easily fry or self destruct with 2,000 "clean" watts. Clipping is what creates heat and doesn't allow the subwoofer to cool down as it would with sine-waves (music, not clipped square waves).

I will always send too much power to a sub rather then too little. Keep the signal clean and you have nothing to worry about.

Ok. I know the elite d4s are rated for 2000 watts rms. They used a tool(dmm?) to calibrate the amp with the head unit volume at 31 out of 35. I also noticed the subwoofer level on the head unit goes from -50 to +10. It was set at +10, then the amp was calibrated. I'm thinking calibrate the amp when the sub level is at -25. What do you think? Also the tri-led pods keep going off, so I sent the first pair back.
As far as the amp goes the level was set at 25% turn.
Bass boost was off.
Everything else was about 1/8 of the way turned up.

ttocs wrote:I will always send too much power to a sub rather then too little. Keep the signal clean and you have nothing to worry about.

Am sure you mean having a 2kwatt amplifier to a 500watt sub is perfectly okay, which is true as long as you don't bottom out the coil (which by then your 2kwatt amplifier will be set around 500-700watts for the sub according to the gain setting). Because the subwoofer will bottom out first before the amplifier clips the signal. I know you know this Scott just making it clear for the OP or anyone reading this thread.

I would hook up a 4000 watt amp to a 2000 watt sub if I could before I would hook a 1000 watt amp to the same 2000 watt sub any day of the week.

Lol...well that's out of my league, I stick with a 3000watt sub and a 400watt amp and that's plenty loud for me. Crazy that the manufacture states it's recommended range is 25-3000 watts ( as if anything under 25 would harm the sub), it's a W10GTI MKII in case your wondering.

Have any of y'all experienced a song that just kills your subs?? Like I said I have ran this for the past two months rattling cars beside me the whole time. No problems.
The song that was playing at the time of the smell and blown sub was o pana by $uicideboy$

Knightrider, what on the head unit would make it clip? Subwoofer level? Q factor? Loud stays off. Eq is balanced at zeros across the board.

when the signal gets to high the top/bottom of the nice smooth sine wave get clipped and made flat. There is a lot of stuff out today that has the bass levels maxed out and its just that much easier for the signal to get to hot for the amp to take. I have noticed that certain songs with certain systems when you get it just right can really sound louder then others but I have never found a specific song that will just melt stuff.

The point I was trying to make though is that more power is safer then distortion/clipping and clipping is reached easier with less power but distortion with more power is a VERY bad thing. I have never had a problem hooking a huge amp up to a sub of my own but I turn it down or make adjustments as soon as I notice distortion. Bass/loudness controls make a huge difference and just a small turn of the bass knob can save your sub and any time you are to the point you are starting to smell your equipment, turn it down no matter how it sounds.

Sorry for the run-on post. I'm here because you guys have more experience than I do, so bear with me. Picture so you can visually see the majority of what I'm working with. Has anyone owned the new elite 12d4s? The tri-led keeps going out. I'll replace and 2 days or so later they just stop working. I love the sound, but I think the design sucks. Who's bright idea was it to stick lights in the middle of a vibrating apacolypse....???
Anyhow, This is gonna be the third elite d4 the shop has put in my left side... they said the coil was roasted for sure, but not due to amp or head unit calibration. Apparently a defective sub. Thank god for warranty.
There is no distortion, even at my max volume (31!). Shop has told me to not take it past 31(35 is max volume for the unit), or I'll blow stuff due to distortion.
I will pay close attention to the clipping indicator light on the amp though, before I continue to drive around.
I have a bass knob at the front, that I primarily use for when cops are around, or people who start road raging because their soccer-mobile shakes while I'm stopped beside them. Haven't ever had to use it due to distortion because I never hear any.
I noticed the shop put my subwoofer level on the head unit (kenwood touch screen, don't have the model number ATM) back to +10. Should I just let them calibrate the amp like that, or insist that the subwoofer level at the head unit be at 0 before the amp gets recalibrated? I don't want to run into the problem of the head unit sending clipping to the amp.
Before it seems like I'm dissing on the shop, I'm not. Any mistakes they have made, they have corrected, free of any additional charges.
But which sounds more realistic? A defective sub powers through for 1-2 months of daily play, just to give up and roast the coil, or, any clipping that I wasn't aware of over that course of time finally became fatal for the sub?

its probably not going to sound best with the bass all the way up, the shop is setting it up that way for a worst case scenario that the customer does not realize that the level at +10, loudness on, bass cube up all the way will somehow NOT equal more bass/better sound. I would at the very least turn it up to see if it was too much but always adjusted mine with the settings at 0, unless it was going in a bass-heads car that had the possibility of smokin a sub and then it was with the bass up.

I am not pointing any blame here, but just posting some general information.

A "roasted" coil is not a sign of a defective sub. Sub defects would be a misaligned coil (so it rubs), glue separation of spider to basket, or surround to basket, loose tinsel leads that break off, etc.

A coil generally burns up from too much power, but can also burn up from thermal restriction. If polyfil plugs the vent hole for example, or if the enclosure is built such that there is not sufficient clearance between the vent hole and the back wall.

Excessive DC output from a failing amplifier would do it too. I am not talking square waves, I am referring to a situation where a Class D amp has a DC offset in its output. This would result in constant heating of the voice coil.

all good info above and not bad info here either.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRBuQW5qrAQ

No sooner had the subwoofer been replaced, it started smelling after a minute of play time. Turned around, shop took it back out. They are gonna turn down the amp next. It's only the left side I have had problems with.
Getting ANOTHER one tomorrow.... the amp apparently had been running at 90%. Making the subs run @peak at all times.... but the right one has had zero problems.... if it was the amp common sense says it would affect both subs, not just the left. Input?
Sincerely,
A Crippled Basshead

They used a voltmeter and checked the ohm on the sub terminals(4.2&4.1) and then checked the speaker wire from the amp to the sub while they had a special cd in the head unit. (90 volts)
That's how they came to the conclusion the amp needs to be turned down.

In your photo there looks like wood pieces, or some part of the box right behind the sub. Is the other side of the box the same as this?

I don't know if this has been asked, but are the subs sharing a common air volume, or is each in its own space?

as eric is mentioning, if the back of a vented subwoofer is blocked it can have issues cooling itself. Next time you are in there ask the shop if they have an O-scope and if they could or would use that instead of the meter.

But smoking a woofer in a minute idunno. What kind of music are you listening too? Does the bass stay clean or is it distorting when you turn it up?

Bass mids and highs are all clean. No distortion. I asked about the piece of wood, to close to the vent hole, they said it's no problem. That's the inner border of the hidden battery box. The top left is the back of the box

Common air volume. The other side has a piece of wood that starts the port behind the sub also.