Midbass filtering

ShockTherapy · Post by **ShockTherapy** » Sat Jul 17, 2010 7:12 am

Hi everyone. I'm not too familiar with using bandpass on the midbass but I've heard it's the way to go... to be honest I wouldnt know where to start. I would normally just use the crossover on the ZX500 to cut it off at around 60hz. I'm going to go with 2 ZX amps which will have processing built in... Does the ZX have the ability for bandpass? I'm friggin lost. Please direct your answers based on me having 2 ZX500s... one for the frontstage, one for the subs. Thanks in advance for your help.

eulogious · Post by **eulogious** » Sat Jul 17, 2010 7:48 am

http://download.phoenixphorum.com/Manua ... 2chann.pdf

ShockTherapy · Post by **ShockTherapy** » Sat Jul 17, 2010 12:13 pm

eulogious wrote:http://download.phoenixphorum.com/Manua ... 2chann.pdf

Thanks but I was hoping for some feedback.

eulogious · Post by **eulogious** » Sat Jul 17, 2010 12:33 pm

I got a zx450, not a 500 ATM, so I can't help ya. Sorry man, good luck though. I will be watching to see what you do.

Stryker · Post by **Stryker** » Sat Jul 17, 2010 6:08 pm

eulogious wrote:I got a zx450, not a 500 ATM, so I can't help ya. Sorry man, good luck though. I will be watching to see what you do.

they are technically almost the same as far as x-over ability in concerned.

eulogious · Post by **eulogious** » Sat Jul 17, 2010 6:11 pm

The manual for the zx450 does say how to setup bandpass, but it's got four channels in it, so I figured that made a difference, since the zx500 manual did not mention it…

I will research it a little more when I get some sleep and see if I come up with anything. My brain is working kinda slow right now...

dBincognito · Post by **dBincognito** » Sat Jul 17, 2010 6:31 pm

As far as I know the 900.7 is the only amp PG made with a bandpass option.

joyride · Post by **joyride** » Sat Jul 17, 2010 7:02 pm

What exactly are you planning to run speaker wise? Its pretty easy if you are running a full passive component set. You will only be able to run a single RCA line back, so plan on losing any "sub" controls on you deck. Run the RCA to the front stage amp. Set it at high pass at 60, and have the output set to bandpass. This will send everything below 60 to the bub amp (you need to run the RCA from the output of said amp to the input of the sub amp). Thi is the easiest way to get a perfect transition between amps.

Using this method means that you are 'bandpassing' the signal from 60 hz to whatever freq the passive XO of the set is at. I am assuming you are running a component set anyway. If you are goingt o go active, you will need a 450/500 combo (or another 2 channels anyway) and then pretty much use the same method.

ShockTherapy · Post by **ShockTherapy** » Sat Jul 17, 2010 8:17 pm

eulogious wrote:The manual for the zx450 does say how to setup bandpass, but it's got four channels in it, so I figured that made a difference, since the zx500 manual did not mention it…

I will research it a little more when I get some sleep and see if I come up with anything. My brain is working kinda slow right now...

Thanks for your help. I'm guessing that the ZX500 isnt set up for it. I just got a good deal on a mint condition Zapco Z600C2sl and I'm considering using it. decisions decisions.

Post by **ttocs** » Sat Jul 17, 2010 9:08 pm

you can alway use an F-mod style cross-over in conjunction with the zx cross over to get the band -pass you want.

dedlyjedly · Post by **dedlyjedly** » Sat Jul 17, 2010 10:00 pm

Wait, what exactly are you running for speakers? Two or three-way? Unfortunately, even if it's only a two-way, you're at least a few channels short of being able to actively filter your speakers.

You need a channel of amplification for EVERY speaker that you plan on running active. Some people run the midrange & tweeter passive and then midbass active (ti elite is a prime example) in a three-way, but even for that situation you would use BOTH ZX amps for your front stage and need something else for sub duties. If you're going entirely active your amplifier needs become even greater!

Post by **ttocs** » Sat Jul 17, 2010 10:33 pm

as he said if you wanted a fully active system with a sub, you would need 2 zx500s to run the componants fully active and another amp for your subs.

shaheen · Post by **shaheen** » Sun Jul 18, 2010 4:12 am

Lots of ways to achieve a bandpass x-over, if your deck has a built in x-over you can use this either in HP or LP and do the converse on yoru amp , this will give you a bandpass x-over.

The other option is to have a active x-over which sits before the amplifers, this is the easiest and will give you the most amoutn of configuration, it all depends on how much do you want to throw into achieving a bandpass.

Caps and coils used to be the thing to use, but they have fallen by the wayside since more and more processing is comming off headunits and amplifiers. Let me check the ZX manual and will let you know.

Later Edit:

Ok, looking at the manual there is a way to achieve what you want , however you need an additional amplifer. I miticed you said you have 2 ZX500's , if you want to go Quasi Active (Midbass active, midrange and tweeter passive) then you need an additional amplifer or else you will be 2 channels short.

From what I gather you have a 3 ways set up right now, this is how I would do it. Another ZX500 , then headunit to amp (Full range signal) , into Amp1 (Subs) , set to LP 60Hz , Then use the Aux outputs on that amp to go to the 2nd amp , so now you have a HP 60Hz (60Hz - 20Khz) as input into the 2nd amp (Midbass) , set this amp to LP at 400Hz, what you have done is created a Bandpass (60Hz from input to 400Hz x-over on amp) to drive your midbass speakers. Then take the Aux output from the 2nd amp which will be at 400Hz HP to the 3rd amp which will drive your midrange and tweeters from 400Hz to 20Khz.

With 2 amps you can get the bandpass bit , but not sure how you would drive the mid and tweeter , unless you use the Aux output from amp2 to the Zapco...........and thats the way to do it.

ShockTherapy · Post by **ShockTherapy** » Sun Jul 18, 2010 6:14 am

shaheen wrote:Lots of ways to achieve a bandpass x-over, if your deck has a built in x-over you can use this either in HP or LP and do the converse on yoru amp , this will give you a bandpass x-over.

The other option is to have a active x-over which sits before the amplifers, this is the easiest and will give you the most amoutn of configuration, it all depends on how much do you want to throw into achieving a bandpass.

Caps and coils used to be the thing to use, but they have fallen by the wayside since more and more processing is comming off headunits and amplifiers. Let me check the ZX manual and will let you know.

Later Edit:

Damn! I didn't know that I would need 2 amps on my frontstage to get this going. After alot of thought I will be using a single Zapco Z600c2 sl to run my frontstage. I was considering going active but I will be staying passive with the CDT 3-way Eurosports. I'm looking for a Zapco balanced crossover so I can set it at 60hz for my midbass. I was using My old Soundstream 1000sx to run my subs but it literally SUCKS on subs! I will be reimplementing the Arc Audio 2500CXL into the mix for sub duty. The Arc literally embarasses the 1000sx when it comes to power, clarity and cone control.

Anyone have any old Zapco Symbilink stuff?

Ok, looking at the manual there is a way to achieve what you want , however you need an additional amplifer. I miticed you said you have 2 ZX500's , if you want to go Quasi Active (Midbass active, midrange and tweeter passive) then you need an additional amplifer or else you will be 2 channels short.

From what I gather you have a 3 ways set up right now, this is how I would do it. Another ZX500 , then headunit to amp (Full range signal) , into Amp1 (Subs) , set to LP 60Hz , Then use the Aux outputs on that amp to go to the 2nd amp , so now you have a HP 60Hz (60Hz - 20Khz) as input into the 2nd amp (Midbass) , set this amp to LP at 400Hz, what you have done is created a Bandpass (60Hz from input to 400Hz x-over on amp) to drive your midbass speakers. Then take the Aux output from the 2nd amp which will be at 400Hz HP to the 3rd amp which will drive your midrange and tweeters from 400Hz to 20Khz.

With 2 amps you can get the bandpass bit , but not sure how you would drive the mid and tweeter , unless you use the Aux output from amp2 to the Zapco...........and thats the way to do it.

dedlyjedly · Post by **dedlyjedly** » Sun Jul 18, 2010 10:00 am

Shaheen mapped it out nicely for you. My only other suggestion would be to consider adding a ZX450 instead of another ZX500. That would allow you to eliminate the passive crossover for the midrange and tweeter and running completely active with the same number of amps.