Phoenix Gold Phorum

Hi... I have a couple of questions according to my setup and hopefully you guys can help me.

My setup is as follow:

Hu: Kenwood 01d
Front speakers: Boston pro 6.4
Rear speakers: monarch kep 135
Subwoofer: saphire 8inch
Sub amp: Phoenix gold M50
Midrange and Tweet amp: Phoenix gold M44
Rear speakers: Phoenix gold M50
Processor, EQ : Rockford EXP2

Now I have my subamp connected to my Rockford unit. But it's not doing so much, I think it can do way more + I can't use my LPL remote.
I'am thinking of connecting my M50 subamp to the output RCA of my M44 and use the internal crossover so I can use my LPL and hopefully it will work better.

1) But my question is will I damage my amps if I connect it like this?


Next, I also have a audiocontrol Epicenter and ESP2 in manual it says that I should be connected before the crossovers (that will be my Rockford unit).

2) But if I connected it like that it's not doing anything?

Id get rid of the rear amp. I dont really advocate using an lpl. Id be more concerned about the sub than the amp though.

The subwoofer is working if I turn the bass gain to half and the normal gain just above half.



"As backup I have een DD1508 subwoofer and a Phoenix gold M100 amp. Is this is not working in the setup."

Jorg wrote:The subwoofer is working if I turn the bass gain to half and the normal gain just above half.



"As backup I have een DD1508 subwoofer and a Phoenix gold M100 amp. Is this is not working in the setup."

turn the lpl all the way up , amp gain all the way down and then set your gains.

You could add a simple electronic cross-over like the ax204 that has lpl ability.

ttocs wrote:You could add a simple electronic cross-over like the ax204 that has lpl ability.

or a basscube and forget the lpl

m44 has also LPL ability, so why ad an crossover.

basscube ?? is that different then an audiocontrol epicenter?

Jorg wrote:m44 has also LPL ability, so why ad an crossover.

basscube ?? is that different then an audiocontrol epicenter?

that depends what the flux capacitor is set at... J/K

it is a single band parametric eq just for bass, not an epicenter by any means.

ttocs wrote:it is a single band parametric eq just for bass, not an epicenter by any means.

but it has a bass knob that wont let you kill anything

Welcome! Where you from??

nutxo wrote:

ttocs wrote:it is a single band parametric eq just for bass, not an epicenter by any means.

but it has a bass knob that wont let you kill anything

not sure that is the case. You can overdrive the signal out of it just like you can on any eq.

I would run your setup as follows...

From headunit, connect the epicenter after it. Then connect the epicenter to the front inputs of the symmetry, then the full range front outputs of the symmetry to the inputs of the M44. Run the outputs (RCA) of the M44 to your sub amp. I suggest against using the second M50 on the rears, but if you must, run it from the rear high pass out of the symmetry. With everything setup like this, the epicenter will work properly, and the LPL44 on the M44 will control the level of your subwoofer.

I am sure you won't like hearing this, but the symmetry is not a very good unit. It is one of the most unreliable car audio devices ever made. It can fail or "act up" in a wide range of ways. One of which is allowing low frequencies to pass through it and kill your speakers. If you really want to be save, and still use it, put a crossover between the symmetry and your M50 you use for rear speakers. This should protect the speakers on down the line.

Eric D wrote:I would run your setup as follows...

From headunit, connect the epicenter after it. Then connect the epicenter to the front inputs of the symmetry, then the full range front outputs of the symmetry to the inputs of the M44. Run the outputs (RCA) of the M44 to your sub amp. I suggest against using the second M50 on the rears, but if you must, run it from the rear high pass out of the symmetry. With everything setup like this, the epicenter will work properly, and the LPL44 on the M44 will control the level of your subwoofer.

I am sure you won't like hearing this, but the symmetry is not a very good unit. It is one of the most unreliable car audio devices ever made. It can fail or "act up" in a wide range of ways. One of which is allowing low frequencies to pass through it and kill your speakers. If you really want to be save, and still use it, put a crossover between the symmetry and your M50 you use for rear speakers. This should protect the speakers on down the line.

Yes that can be the case.. I played with the symmetry for some time now, but I don't really like it. So I thinking to get it out of my system.

Can you suggest a setup with the parts that I have. Here is my list.

Kenwood xxv 01d
phoenix gold TBA1 transmitter
Phoenix gold M50
Phoenix gold M50
Phoenix gold M44
Phoenix gold M100
Phoenix gold outlaw
Phoenix gold zx450
Phoenix gold ax406a
Phoenix gold eq230
Phoenix gold powerflow
Phoenix gold xvr4 ( 2pcs )
Fanatiq XR 3 pro ( 4 pcs )
Morel hybrid 5.5"
Morel Hybrid 6.5"
Boston pro 6.4LF
Digital Designs 1508
Phoenix saphire 8"
Phase Aliante 8"
Rockford Symmetry
Audiocontrol ESP2
Audiocontrol Epicenter
Steg K4.01
Steg K2.01

What are the goals of your system? Do you want it too sound great, or be really loud, or some combination?

It seems like most people come up with a "dream" setup in their mind or on paper, and then they spend a while acquiring all this equipment for it, and once they actually install it, they generally are not all that happy. I think the best way to do car audio is to start out simple with an install, and then expand it based on what weak points it has. Yes a lot of people want to build everything in so it looks really professional and clean, but this can be done with an expandable system as well, it just requires more planning.

Based on the assortment of equipment you have, you have a ton of options. And what I suggest is what I would do, not what you should do. But maybe you would like my plan, so here it is...

Run the Kenwood deck to the ZX450.
Configure the ZX450 as a sub only amp. Its crossover should allow for its RCA output to be high pass.
From the ZX450 run the Right RCA output to a M50 bridged (you will need an RCA "Y" cable on the inputs to the M50)
From the ZX450 run the Left RCA output to another M50 bridged.
Use the bridged M50s to run your components up front. The Bostons are nice, but the Morels might be a better choice.
Use the ZX450 to run any sub setup you like. You can do a single sub with dual voice coils, or 4 subs, it is all up to you.
With this setup the ZX450's LPL44 will control your bass level.

Now use the system and see what you think. If it is lacking anywhere, start working on those areas.
A natural upgrade would be to install the EQ230 between the Kenwood deck and the ZX450. Then if you wish you can switch your cables over with the TBA transmitter.

You can add the ESP2 or Epicenter later if you so choose.

You also have the option to skip the ZX450 and use the ax406a with an M100 for subs. Or have the M100 run the components, and the pair of M50s run the subs.

There are a lot of options with all that equipment.

Eric D wrote:What are the goals of your system? Do you want it too sound great, or be really loud, or some combination?

It seems like most people come up with a "dream" setup in their mind or on paper, and then they spend a while acquiring all this equipment for it, and once they actually install it, they generally are not all that happy. I think the best way to do car audio is to start out simple with an install, and then expand it based on what weak points it has. Yes a lot of people want to build everything in so it looks really professional and clean, but this can be done with an expandable system as well, it just requires more planning.

Based on the assortment of equipment you have, you have a ton of options. And what I suggest is what I would do, not what you should do. But maybe you would like my plan, so here it is...

Run the Kenwood deck to the ZX450.
Configure the ZX450 as a sub only amp. Its crossover should allow for its RCA output to be high pass.
From the ZX450 run the Right RCA output to a M50 bridged (you will need an RCA "Y" cable on the inputs to the M50)
From the ZX450 run the Left RCA output to another M50 bridged.
Use the bridged M50s to run your components up front. The Bostons are nice, but the Morels might be a better choice.
Use the ZX450 to run any sub setup you like. You can do a single sub with dual voice coils, or 4 subs, it is all up to you.
With this setup the ZX450's LPL44 will control your bass level.

Now use the system and see what you think. If it is lacking anywhere, start working on those areas.
A natural upgrade would be to install the EQ230 between the Kenwood deck and the ZX450. Then if you wish you can switch your cables over with the TBA transmitter.

You can add the ESP2 or Epicenter later if you so choose.

You also have the option to skip the ZX450 and use the ax406a with an M100 for subs. Or have the M100 run the components, and the pair of M50s run the subs.

There are a lot of options with all that equipment.

Mmm that sounds interresting. Why use the ax406a with the M100? ( the M100 also has an internal xover )

I want my setup to be SQ in the first place... A little SPL but not really necessary.
For the subs I have very limited space. Now I have a closed enclosure with only 14ltr.

You are right. I completely forgot the M100 has a crossover. You would not need the ax406a for that setup then. Running a M100 and a pair of M50s would work well in my opinion.

Don't forget, you could use the Outlaw and an M50 to achieve the same thing.

Eric D wrote:You are right. I completely forgot the M100 has a crossover. You would not need the ax406a for that setup then. Running a M100 and a pair of M50s would work well in my opinion.

Don't forget, you could use the Outlaw and an M50 to achieve the same thing.

Won't I damage the M100 if I connect the M50's to one RCA output, with the Y-splitters?

not at all

and then I have to add another amp for my rear channel??

Don't add rears initially. If you feel you need them when done, then add something. Most properly installed systems don't need rear speakers, as they just take away from the front speakers and make the system sound worse.

at this moment I got my new setup in.

It's like this:

-M100 drives subwoofer.
-M50 drives front speakers 6.5" morel
-M44 drives rear speakers and front tweeters

1)
The m50 is connected to the M100. But I don't like it like this because the front speakers only produce sound if the subwoofer is turned up.
Then the crossover can't be set at the headunit and I can't use the equalizer for the front speakers.

Internal crossover from the M100 is selected and the Highpass filter is selected for the M50 ( all selected at the M100 )

2)
The subwoofer that I use at the moment is the 8"saphire 120watt rms. ( want to change it to the DD1508 or Phase aliante )

The M100 produce 455 watt RMS bridged, that kind off power would my subwoofer blowup but that isn't doing it.

M100 also has a clip led light, but it isn't flashing, not even at 3/4 of gain.


Please help me out here.
You suggest get the rear speakers out, and then what amps should I use and how connected them?


Ohh and uhm thanks alot for your help. I really appreciate it.

What equalizer are you referring too? One in your head unit, or the EQ230?

If you want more flexibility with the crossover, then the AX406a will be your next best bet. It has more options than the one built into the M100.

I'm reffering to my EQ on my headunit

Ok, so I have decided to get my rear speakers out.
Speaker specs:

Morel Hybrid.
140watt rms
300 watt peak power

M50 got 2x85rms
M100 got 2x160rms

So the M44 can also go out of the system.

Then I got some option left:

1) M44 out and M50 in
2) M44 and M50 out and Outlaw in

option 1:

Then I can use 1 M50 for the tweeters and the other M50 for the speakers in the door and the M100 for the subwoofer.


Option 2 :

I can use the M50 for the tweeters and the M100 for the speakers in the door and the other M100 for the subwoofer.



Second question :

My headunit has for the front and rear channel a HPF of max. 250Hz how is that possible for the tweeters?