what is the best 10 or 12" sub 500watts 4ohm

[Bfowler]

not trying to be a fan boy (says the moderator on the PG fan site)

but i really do think the RSDc destroys the w6 in every conceivable way.

ben, have a box or the badwidth to audition a RSDc 12?

Yes. As a matter of fact, I can write a rewview as a part of my regular posts over on SoundDomain.com. I would prefer a 10" as that would be apples to apples for me. But heck, yeah.

You know what I was impressed with for the little amount of money I spent on it? A TMA 10".... Thing hit hard and felt good.

But know that I am 100% SQ oriented and all of my materials are top notch, no eMule crap. (Chesky, TelArc, etc.) So I may not be coming at this from the same angle.

i only have the 12

but if you are still up for it, shoot me your address in a PM

[stipud]

Brian, I can not recall if you said you had tried the two W6's vs. the rsd'c or not.. think you said the Vanillas were better than the w6's and the RSDc's were better than the vanilla's... right something like that..
For me, not sure about Mike (who started this thred) but I am just so apprehensive about going with the RSDC's b/c of the subconscience feeling of how can they be better with two of them costing same as one W6?? know what I mean.. I hate to sound like I do not trust you or anything b/c that's certainly not the case.. just concerned about the idealogy of "you get what you pay for"... And I'm kinda like the guy that is willing to pay that premium for name/build quality, etc... am I wrong fo0r thinking/feeling that way??? Inclined to try them... just wouldn't wanna jump out there and then end up being disapointed... which 20% of me feel that probably wouldn't be the case.. but just not made of money I guess....

That was me actually. Comparing my RSD 10 to a 10W6, I preferred the RSD. Bdubs also compared an RSD 12 to a 12W6, and gave it better marks as well.
http://phoenixphorum.com/12-subwoofer-t ... -vt16.html

I personally found my pair of RSD 12's sounded really good, but a bit boomy on the kind of music I listen to. Perhaps that was due to me underpowering them substantially. I also couldn't get them to blend with my front stage as well as my RSD10. I still preferred them to my IDMax however.

After that I tried out an RSD comp 12. The comps play with much better clarity and timing than any sub I have had in my car to date. If you listen to something with lots of low, oscillating frequencies, like an explosion... it actually sounds like an explosion. All of my other subwoofers would just turn it into a wall of indiscernible boom. The difference is quite uncanny actually.

The RSD comps have an MSRP near the price of the W6 actually. The only reason you can get them cheaper is because PG has a huge distributor leak to eBay, which allows them to sell for dollars over cost. JL has very tight controls on their distributors, so very little of their product will escape to eBay... and the stuff that does, costs near MSRP anyways!

So, since the RSD comps are so cheap... why don't you grab a pair? Worst case scenario you don't like them and lose a couple bucks when you resell them. I REALLY don't think that will be the case however

[flogger11]

I am looking at the Treo 12" and the jl 12w6
what box size is the Treo any specs model numbers??
let me know
thanks guys

Good call on the Treo! Which model are you considering? Here is a link to the offcial Treo website, it will answer all your questions.... Trust me on the Treo, it is the best sub I have ever heard!! Tell you what, I will personally put up $25 if you dont like it and decide to resell it.
Let me know what model you are looking at and what you are using for an amp. I am running mine in a 1.2 cu ft sealed enclosure and it is unreal, TREO, there is no substitute!

http://treoonline.com/

[fuzzysnuggleduck]

Tell you what, I will personally put up $25 if you dont like it and decide to resell it

Do you, by any chance, work for Treo?

[flogger11]

Tell you what, I will personally put up $25 if you dont like it and decide to resell it

Do you, by any chance, work for Treo?

LOL! Nope, cableguy here! They are that good I will put my $ where my mouth is...

[kg1961]

thanks everyone
my sub is bought!!! I will wait untill it here before I tell people what I bought.
I will have to show it after my FAS is installed with a bass cube, 204a and 406a, 20f power core and some other itme in my 328i 2007 bmw!!!!
anyone have nice pics of install with covers to hide the items

[mhyde71]

I might take you up on that cableguy!

Shoot me best place to get them from 12" 4ohm DVC's and allow me to have a look .. do you know best place to get from or just go to the Bay?? and it is the SSi's, right? matt

[mhyde71]

what are false floors?

[flogger11]

I might take you up on that cableguy!

Shoot me best place to get them from 12" 4ohm DVC's and allow me to have a look .. do you know best place to get from or just go to the Bay?? and it is the SSi's, right? matt

Yep, the SSi is the best street series they make! You need a min of 500 watts RMS on it, pref 700+. Otherwise look at one of the other series, TSX is 400 watts RMS and the TE is 500 watts RMS. Is space at a premium in your install? That would be the deciding factor for me between a ported or sealed enclosure... Yep, best place for price is ebay, I have bought two Treo's from there and had great luck.

[Jopop]

Lol this is totally not relevant to your discussion but the Hertz ES250D i put in today kicks all sorts of ass. Not even close to muddy or boomy, and plays nice up really high (but soundstage will suffer). This thing plays music, not just generic bass.

And it packs a real punch.. i need to deaden my trunk quite a bit though, it rattles..

[mhyde71]

here is my install config: http://phoenixphorum.com/2002-my-nissan ... t5764.html

I have sealed box, with the box having been designed for 12" W6's. I am running an MS-2250 Orig, config'ed to 2ohm stereo... which i believe to be right around 2x500. But of course I do not run around with it on full throttle all the time/constantly, but (like someone said here recent) I do enjoy a highway back massage on way to/fro home or out-n-bout doing deliveries. So maybe the fact that the MS-2250 is rated @ 2x517wrms @ 2ohm's stereo... and like 1100 4 ohm bridged I think... so either way i think the one I need to shoot for is the 4ohm DVC, right?

Would like to see about running 2 ohm stereo... but I am not there yet with my cooling config, and or if the 2250 can even.

[flogger11]

I assume you are going to use two woofers? If so, go ahead and run your amp 2 ohm stereo (with a summed mono signal), putting well over 500 watts rms on each Treo SSi. This combo will knock your socks off, thats the $25 guarantee!! LOL! Oh ya, no need to worry about your MS-2250 running a 2 ohm stereo load, it will laugh that off even w/ no cooling help...

[stipud]

Oh ya, no need to worry about your MS-2250 running a 2 ohm stereo load, it will laugh that off even w/ no cooling help...

You do realize he's talking about the ORIGINAL MS2250, not the TA right? Those amps came with fan shrouds because they could saturate their heat sinks at 4 ohms. Hell Nico's original spec MS1000 gets quite hot to the touch when IDLE.

[Bfowler]

and he is running it upsidedown in a box in the back of the SUV....hmmm

[mhyde71]

yeah original 2250... and I only have one cross (stinger) fan on it and it doesn't do such a wonderful job.. still trying to work out how to get more ventilation in there for it.. but until then.. do not mind focussing on possibly some other sub's... Might could be talked into the tREO's.

Summed mon-signal is by taking the left and rights and making them (y-Adapter) into two and then taking one from each... ahhh... already lost myself... how do i go about doing that, pleeeease?!?!

[mhyde71]

and he is running it upsidedown in a box in the back of the SUV....hmmm

tru'dat too!

[mhyde71]

I am working on getting some other fans on it... just trying to figure out how and stuff... for now what I have been doing is opening it right up so it almost rests against the speaker box, but not. and holding it open with a slab of wood wedged in there under the hindges keeping it from closing...so it is in effect just about completely verticle when propped up. or I can lower it down a little and have it at a 45% angle just the same.

[stipud]

Summed mon-signal is by taking the left and rights and making them (y-Adapter) into two and then taking one from each... ahhh... already lost myself... how do i go about doing that, pleeeease?!?!

Summed mono wouldn't be necessary in your case. It was necessary for KPower, who planned on running a single sub; in which case you want a mono signal so the voicecoils get the same power. In your case, your subs will play just fine in stereo

In 99.95% of recordings, bass is recorded in mono anyways.

[mhyde71]

Summed mon-signal is by taking the left and rights and making them (y-Adapter) into two and then taking one from each... ahhh... already lost myself... how do i go about doing that, pleeeease?!?!

Summed mono wouldn't be necessary in your case. It was necessary for KPower, who planned on running a single sub. In this case you want a mono signal so the voicecoils get the same power. In your case, your subs will play just fine in stereo

In 99.95% of recordings, bass is recorded in mono anyways.

I see and is that why when last night for first time in long time I can recall I was fooling with balance controls... and saw/heard/felt that when I ran only on right or left the subs were next to nothing.. it wasn't until the balance was balanced did I get sub action???

[stipud]

I see and is that why when last night for first time in long time I can recall I was fooling with balance controls... and saw/heard/felt that when I ran only on right or left the subs were next to nothing.. it wasn't until the balance was balanced did I get sub action???

By balancing to the right, only your right sub would be playing. This should sound fine, as long as your enclosure has a divider between the two subs.

[Bfowler]

KH was trying to run a quad VC sub with a duel bridged 4 channel If i recall correctly.

for your application a summed mono won't be necessary

[mhyde71]

I see and is that why when last night for first time in long time I can recall I was fooling with balance controls... and saw/heard/felt that when I ran only on right or left the subs were next to nothing.. it wasn't until the balance was balanced did I get sub action???

By balancing to the right, only your right sub would be playing. This should sound fine, as long as your enclosure has a divider between the two subs.

enclosure has divider, yes, and I could tell that the just the right sub, or left, was playing but it certainly wasn't like 50% of when the two were running... more like 25 or less like no sub at all barely... what might be going on?? and as i fade back to the opposite side as it inches over it comes in like real strong just shy of being balance but noton a gradual slide... know what I mean?? i.e. all way to left and right cut out... almost no sub action... can barely hear it... fade back to center and it's not just unitl i am right up on being balanced does it come back into full swing. kinda weird.

[Jopop]

X2 on the RSD comp sub... Simply the best woofer I have owned. It just an extremely well rounded sub, which has no problems playing anything you can throw at it. It blends magnificently well with your front stage, even when it doesn't have dedicated midbass. It gets quite loud off of little power as well! I was amazed to hear what it can do on 300 watts, it's audibly louder than my previous 2xRSD12 (plain) install.

If you have dedicated midbass up front, and only plan to use the sub below 50-60Hz, then I would instead recommend a regular RSD, or better yet a Xenon or IDMax, since they are beasts of bottom end. I found all of them to be WAY too sloppy at playing metal however, and just poorly timed for rap. The RSD comp woofer had no trouble with this in my install.

Since buying it, it's the only sub that I haven't thought "if only it could do this better", and I think it has become a permanent part of my setup. I might still pick up a 10" version of it, just because I have a really nice box that Bfowler built me (that is, unless he feels up to building me a 12" box as well hehe).

Not to hijack thread, but i burnt (yet) another sub today, so I'll need a new one. Is the RSDc 10" as good as the RSDc12"? I could do both but the 10" enclosure i have is a really good fit in my car.

Oh and stipud I'm asking you since i guess our musical tastes are quite similar (I like thrash, death, death/thrash, grind, grind/thrash/death, a little black metal and everything in between). I'm having trouble finding a sub that isn't all "rumble rumble", needs to be clear sounding and pack a good punch

[stipud]

Not to hijack thread, but i burnt (yet) another sub today, so I'll need a new one. Is the RSDc 10" as good as the RSDc12"? I could do both but the 10" enclosure i have is a really good fit in my car.

Oh and stipud I'm asking you since i guess our musical tastes are quite similar (I like thrash, death, death/thrash, grind, grind/thrash/death, a little black metal and everything in between). I'm having trouble finding a sub that isn't all "rumble rumble", needs to be clear sounding and pack a good punch

RSD Comp 10 is the perfect subwoofer for you, my deathgrind friend

No rumble at all. That's what I love about the thing! It's the cleanest death metal sub I've ever heard

I really should post some videos...

[mhyde71]

and would it be good for the hip hop reggae and r&b folks ??? The 12" that is???