RSDC Really Coming Out!

[Bfowler]

I hate to say it but they are using similar materials that the Kicker W7 uses for elastomer's, and cone materials. At least by the description this is what I read, perhaps the description could be misleading to me.

What is the X max ? I don't see all the real tech spec's I am use to seeing with PG products. I guess thats the Rodin effect in action

I would like to see all the real spec's for the driver before I pass any judgment......C

kicker's w7?

it actually reminds me alot of the xenon.....

[Phoenixcolt]

Shit u guys are right, the mag looks terribly small compared to that proto pic...I would love to try it out anyway. I mean if 170 watts made me happy enough on an RSd 12, I imagine this would be infinitely better...tho if I hear bad things about it, undoubtedly fat bastard will be going back into my next install .

I bet they rated it at 600 because they want us all to have a reason to buy the roadster to power it...which I would if 600 would actually cut it for this sub...time will tell.

[rolandk]

[Francious70]

14mm?? What, are they kidding?

[Bfowler]

14mm... good thing they added that extra .5mm to the existing rsd.

this displeases me....although the 92db efficacy makes me happy!


someone graph it!

(my graphs always turn out wrong.....)

[bdubs767]

according to some one on DIYMA these are for sale now


MSRP $299

[bdubs767]

How does Pg measure the Xmax? Is it excursion or the height of the VC?

If excursion is that one way? Peak to Peak? Max or linear?

[Bfowler]

according to some one on DIYMA these are for sale now


MSRP $299

that msrp might be correct...but i call shenanigans on it being for sale now.

[1moreamp]

THX for the specs C



Yeah I saw the 14.5 mm and WTF myself, my Ti's are better than that, I think its a typo or they are using single direction only, maybe ????

[stipud]

14.8mm (to those who think it's 14 -- you need some glasses) one way excursion is quite good. The Ti Elite had 14.01mm, and the RSD has only 13.5mm. Then again, the Xenon 10D4 had a whopping 20mm one-way (but was really inefficient).

Here are your graphs... yellow is RSD, orange is RSDc and blue is Ti Elite, all measured "free air". From the looks of it this driver offers the same frequency response as the Elite, with much higher efficiency. It looks like the driver can handle about 1500 watts while still playing it's full frequency range, where the RSD will hit Xmax at 20Hz with 700 watts. The Elite could be run up to about 1750 without hitting Xmax at 20 in free air. Not sure if the RSDc is thermally capable of 1500, but at least it works on paper.

So for about 600+ watts the RSDc will likely be a better substitute for the RSD. Anywhere below, and the RSD will be slightly more efficient, and play lower as well.

[stipud]

RSDc 10 seems to be good to 1400 watts as well. It has about 3dB less output than the 12 at the same power, due to the difference in surface area. It actually follows the Ti Elite graph VERY close... so we have a 10" here with the same output curve as a Ti Elite.

[rolandk]

I talked to Glenn the Acoustics Engineer and he says the 14.8mm Xmax spec is one way excursion.

[Bfowler]

im 90% i will be putting the 10 in my car.

i can't decided if i should go with one x600.1 or two....

[bdubs767]

92db sensitivity one x600.1 will be fine

[dedlyjedly]

I am still stunned at the rating, given all the hype for this sub, and seeing as it was supposed to be a elite replacement. I wasnt expecting an all out spl sub, just something on the lines of the elite power, and volume wise. Taking one look at this thing does not look up to the task, but time will tell..

Just remember that most of those big-number subs out there don't "handle" all that power, they WASTE it! That said, I still know what you're saying. Visually it's a little underwhelming, especially considering PG fans have been waiting sooooo long for some premium product.

The efficiency for the 10 and 12 are rated @ 92dB and 94dB respectively, but did anyone notice the input level. Both those specs are achieved with 2.83V input on the dual 2 ohm versions of the subs. That's 8 watts of input with the coils wired in parallel to achieve those specs.

[Bfowler]

The efficiency for the 10 and 12 are rated @ 92dB and 94dB respectively, but did anyone notice the input level. Both those specs are achieved with 2.83V input on the dual 2 ohm versions of the subs. That's 8 watts of input with the coils wired in parallel to achieve those specs.

um, so is that a good thing or bad thing. what are they normally tested at?

[stipud]

The efficiency for the 10 and 12 are rated @ 92dB and 94dB respectively, but did anyone notice the input level. Both those specs are achieved with 2.83V input on the dual 2 ohm versions of the subs. That's 8 watts of input with the coils wired in parallel to achieve those specs.

1 watt spl ~= 84.9 for 12 and 83.2 for 10. Seems to be about the same as the RSDs.

[Francious70]

2.83 V is what companies rate 8 ohm speakers at. It's the equivalent of 2 watts at 4 ohms, and 8 watts at 2 ohms, ect...

[Bfowler]

so...i guess what im trying to figure out is...is it a valid measurment or not.

if its only 83db, then i might as well stick with my xenon 10d2...

[stipud]

so...i guess what im trying to figure out is...is it a valid measurment or not.

if its only 83db, then i might as well stick with my xenon 10d2...

It's a valid measurement, but it just happens to make lower impedance loads look good (note the highest ratings are the dual 2 ohm in parallel). The equivalent 1 watt per meter rating you are looking for is ~83dB for the 10". The equivalent 1w/m rating of your Xenon is about 79dB.

[dedlyjedly]

um, so is that a good thing or bad thing. what are they normally tested at?

The standard used to be 1 watt input at 1 meter distance (1W/1M). Since most people just look at the output level in dB and don't consider the input variables manufacturers have started to pump more power in to give the appearance of greater sensitivity.

[stipud]

2.83 V is what companies rate 8 ohm speakers at. It's the equivalent of 2 watts at 4 ohms, and 8 watts at 2 ohms, ect...

V = sqrt ( I * W )
2.83 = sqrt ( 8 * W)
2.83 ^ 2 = 8 * W
(2.83 ^ 2)/8 = W
8.0089/8 = W
1.0011 = W

So... 2.83V at 8 ohms = 1 watt.

But 2.83V at 4 ohms = 2 watts
at 2 ohms = 4 watts
and at 1 ohm = 8 watts

So basically 2.83V ratings are impedance independent... constant voltage with impedance drop means increasing wattage. Rule of thumb states that for each doubling of power you gain 3dB. So let's take that 94.2dB at 1 ohm, and since we doubled power over 8 ohms 3 times.... that gives us 9dB of gain, which gives us 94.2-9 ~= 85.2dB efficiency. Bassbox calculated it at 84.9, so the rule of thumb is still valid here too

The 1W/1M standard is much better for figuring out how much louder a speaker will be, given a set wattage. The 2.83V rating is still valid if you are want to compare the relative loudness of speakers on the same amplifier (which outputs a certain voltage!).

This has been today's "Caveat Emptor"

All things considered, this is still a really good woofer. Please check how they rate other speakers... you might find those with 90+dB efficiencies have gone with the 2.83V ratings as well. Don't forget to drop 3 decibels off for each time you halve the impedance!

[Stewart]

The RSDc was designed to be underated, affordable and an incredible value. Same design approach as the RSD.

[stipud]

The RSDc was designed to be underated, affordable and an incredible value. Same design approach as the RSD.

Hmmm... you wouldn't be Stewart Millager would you?

Always good to know when we've got readers from PG HQ.

[mr tibbs]

2 of these on the x2000.1 might not be to bad. Maybe this will be considered for my next install!