ARGH, HELP

Post by **Bfowler** » Tue Feb 05, 2008 5:03 pm

wow....amazon has quite a bit pg pg stuff actually

http://www.amazon.com/Phoenix-Gold-Xeno ... 9&sr=1-158

wolfman1966 · Post by **wolfman1966** » Tue Feb 05, 2008 10:20 pm

hmmm now I'm tempted to get that 400.1 and buy the LPL knob too

Post by **mhyde71** » Tue Feb 05, 2008 10:55 pm

I have a MS2125 and a PG Octane 800.1 both for sale honest seller greenmtngiftbooks on eBay 99.8% with 300+ feedback...
Here's pricing/spec's:
PG Octane Monoblock Rated 400WRMS @ 4ohm; 800 @ 2 Ohm $75 shipped to lowers USA

MS 2125TA may be a lil more than you need but keep the gain way down:
Here are spec's for ORIG 2125 Believe a little lower for 2125TA

2 x 125W @ 4 ohms (12.5V)
2 x 160W @ 4 ohms (13.8V - <0.05% THD)
2 x 255W @ 2 ohms (13.8V)
1 x 510W @ 4 ohms bridge (13.8V)

great condition - It's got two strikes though it'sa used and it's white. Pic's ava upon request! 300 Shipped Lower 48

mhyde_16@hotmail.com

wolfman1966 · Post by **wolfman1966** » Tue Feb 05, 2008 11:17 pm

hyde, does that octane have the slot for the LPL, if so ...for $75 thats doable ...in a couple of weeks when I get paid again.....if you can hold it....plus...I cant use Ebay
dont know if thats a problem

anyway, pics of the octane? Scheatham@hotmail.com

fowler, what do you think of the octane? for 75 shipped, thats hard to beat.

Post by **mhyde71** » Tue Feb 05, 2008 11:21 pm

have the slot for the LPL (check afirmative), I dont have the actual cord/unit but it does exsist, but I also have the box, manual, and little aluiminum bars that run along the side there. I took tghem off b/c they rattle. I recently got a 2250 and couple 275's so I simply have it sitting in my office right now.

Be happy to assist and wait for you just say when... no rush at this end.

Thanks... MH

wolfman1966 · Post by **wolfman1966** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 1:09 am

ok, I can buy the LPL Off the internet for about 10 bucks...so thats fine...
have you sent the pics yet? also....i get paid again on the 20th.....so I should be able to get the amp then.

Post by **Bfowler** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 8:53 am

the octane is a solid amp. obviously the xenon is beefier and has some more features....but $75 for 300@4ohms and 600@2 is a deal

Post by **mhyde71** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 9:08 am

Just sent you pic's wolfgang...

Post by **mhyde71** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 9:14 am

CORRECTION: I stand corrected...
RMS @ 4ohm = 300
RMS @ 2ohm = 600
Sorry about that... Thanks BFOWLER!
PG MANUAL: ftp://www.rodinaudio.com/Phoenix%20Gold ... manual.pdf

Post by **mhyde71** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 9:17 am

OH & The spec's I provide for the 2125 I have also then might be off ajust the same as it is a 2125TA not orig. - sorry about that... i may not be wrong but it's certianly possible..

Post by **Rold Gold** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 9:25 am

AMEN BROTHER ASTLEY!!!!!!!

The LPL is the best thing since PUSSY!!!! (and I play with both alot)

I too play with the LPL more than any other component not to mention the fact that in the event you need to cut the bass in a hurry you can. It's saved me atleast 3 tickets that I know of.

I don't know much about the RE's but I do know that the SX12 will take 1000 watts to the face and not blink so the 8" should take 400 each without problems. I'd strap on a Ti600.2 and thump........

Post by **mhyde71** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 9:39 am

what exactly does LPL do, I always knew it was there but thought it was nothing more than RBG or something... Needless to say never had it hooked up.. but what makes it different than RBG.. I just looked it up on Google and read a little bit... but still in the dark... MH

Post by **Eric D** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 9:40 am

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion of the LPL. I personally find it to be one of the worst items ever made for car audio, right up there with in dash EQs. In my town, the use of an LPL (or any other bass control designed to be dash mounted) is the defining line between a serious car audio enthusiast, and a high school kid on a budget with junk factory speakers running off deck power, and a 2000W bass amp in the trunk with a control knob on the dash. “Look how cool this is, I can crank my bumps!”

If you don’t want to be pulled over for your stereo, just hit the mute button on your deck, or the attenuator, or pause.

Post by **Bfowler** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 9:52 am

^ completely disagree. with the range of music i listen too, it is used, and useful. constantly.

it just attenuates the bass, so i leave it high on rap and electronic music, and scale it down on mellower songs.

Post by **fuzzysnuggleduck** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 9:59 am

Bfowler wrote:^ completely disagree. with the range of music i listen too, it is used, and useful. constantly.

it just attenuates the bass, so i leave it high on rap and electronic music, and scale it down on mellower songs.

I totally agree.

I listen to enough different genres of music and each demands it's own ratio of bass to mids/highs. Rap/hip hop demands increased bass but jazz can really do without my subs pounding. Also, since music production is all over the place, I find many tracks either are produced with too much bass (radio mixes, etc.) while other music is produced with too little bass for my tastes.

I never use the LPL to turn down the bass quickly, I have a mute button to suppress my stereo when needed. I use the LPL to adjust how much bass I want to be listening to without fumbling around in my deck settings which is a royal pain in the ass while driving. The LPL allows me to adjust for how much bass I want while still keeping my eyes on the road.

Post by **mhyde71** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 10:02 am

But what is difference between LPL and RBG dont both simply adjust the amount of bass or is the LPL more frequency related???

Post by **Eric D** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 10:07 am

If you need to adjust how much bass you want, then either your stereo is not adjusted properly, or you prefer to not listen to music as the artist intended.

The sure fire way to get less bass is to turn the volume down. Then you have less bass, and you are still listening to the music balanced like it should be.

Far too many people don’t use their car stereos for music reproduction; they use to get them noticed as they boom by. Do you also have a LPL on your home stereo?

Give it time, they will start popping up as well. People like gimmicks, and a bass knob for the home stereo will be soon on its way!

Post by **stipud** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 10:27 am

With great power comes great responsibility. The LPL only adjusts the sensitivity of the amp, instead of artificially boosting the signal, so unless you're forcing the amp into clipping, I see no disadvantage to it.

I personally configure my stereo so it sounds like I intended it. Screw what the artist thinks... they don't have to listen to their music in my car. Besides, with varying conditions in an automobile (road noise, etc), you can never have a perfectly flat monitor setup. On the other hand, I completely agree with your ideology in my home stereo. I try to reproduce it as the artist intended, as the environment is much better suited for that.

Post by **Bfowler** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 10:32 am

Eric D wrote:If you need to adjust how much bass you want, then either your stereo is not adjusted properly, or you prefer to not listen to music as the artist intended.

The sure fire way to get less bass is to turn the volume down. Then you have less bass, and you are still listening to the music balanced like it should be.

i learned long ago that debating with you will eventually lead the masses chiming in creating a mass cluster...mess

so i will just say....i disagree with your opinion's of the lpl. in both the way its used, and the mindset of those who use it.

Post by **Eric D** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 10:37 am

stipud wrote:With great power comes great responsibility. The LPL only adjusts the sensitivity of the amp, instead of artificially boosting the signal, so unless you're forcing the amp into clipping, I see no disadvantage to it.

I agree with this.

However, find me someone who is using an LPL and not running the amp into clipping. These people do exist, but they are a very small percentage.

A lot of my gripe with the LPL is based on the principle of the thing. Countless people here complain about the lack of a MS like product and want PG to get back to their roots, etc. Well, the ZPA, the MS, and even the ZPX2 all lack a LPL. These are flagship models I am talking about.

Bass knobs (LPL like or not) were what allowed amps from the likes of Pyramid, Boss, Jensen, etc to get a foot hold on the market and all but kill the high end.

Next, the LPL adds distortion. Is it a lot, no. But it is there none the less. It is based on a transconductance amp IC which is in the circuit path and is degrading performance. There is a reason PG made it a LPL (Low Pass Level), and not a FRL (Full Range Level) control. Thank God for us PG did not do like other companies where the signal runs all the way to the dash and the knob is just an attenuator for the line level, which then comes all the way back to the amp. If you want noise in your system, this is a great way to get it.

Post by **Eric D** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 10:43 am

I should really just let this go, and that is what I am going to do.

I no longer represent the market. My goals for car audio died with all the past people who got out of the hobby at the end of the 90’s. I still conform to the ideals of the previous car audio generation who often put more into their stereo then their car was even worth. We are simply dinosaurs today.

Post by **Rold Gold** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 10:48 am

Eric D wrote: In my town, the use of an LPL (or any other bass control designed to be dash mounted) is the defining line between a serious car audio enthusiast, and a high school kid on a budget with junk factory speakers running off deck power, and a 2000W bass amp in the trunk with a control knob on the dash. “Look how cool this is, I can crank my bumps!”

If you don’t want to be pulled over for your stereo, just hit the mute button on your deck, or the attenuator, or pause.

Personally, I've been out of high school for 10 years sooo....

And my KDC-x969 only has one setting....LOUD
It's not hard to get there with 4 Ti 12's either.

I've always used an LPL in all my PG systems. I found that it gave me a better adjusting tool for the everyday listener. Just my opin

Post by **Eric D** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 10:52 am

FuzzyHoNutz wrote:
Eric D wrote: In my town, the use of an LPL (or any other bass control designed to be dash mounted) is the defining line between a serious car audio enthusiast, and a high school kid on a budget with junk factory speakers running off deck power, and a 2000W bass amp in the trunk with a control knob on the dash. “Look how cool this is, I can crank my bumps!”

If you don’t want to be pulled over for your stereo, just hit the mute button on your deck, or the attenuator, or pause.
Personally, I've been out of high school for 10 years sooo....

And my KDC-x969 only has one setting....LOUD
It's not hard to get there with 4 Ti 12's either.

If you are running 4 Ti12s, it is pretty clear my points made in this discussion don’t apply to you.

Post by **Rold Gold** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 11:14 am

Don't get me wrong, I hear what yer saying about the issues that the LPL brings to the table and I'd prefer SQ over DB any day of the week. I also prefer to keep the sound inside my car. And I agree that the real flagship amps shouldn't have an LPL but rather rely apon the sound processing of another component insuring the amp produces true unadulterated clean power. But what to use? Most of the high-end HU's have 8v pre-outs, built-in eq's and sub control but I wouldn't rely on them. I think the LPL is a for ALL types of audiophiles from the vet to the newbie.

Post by **Eric D** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 11:19 am

I cannot argue with that.

You are free to continue using yours, and I will continue to not install them in my stereo or anyone else’s I work on. Maybe someday when I have children, I will install one to protect my infant’s ears, but in that case I would likely just put a switch on the remote line to the bass amp.