SQ Differences?

Post by **mhyde71** » Thu Mar 20, 2008 11:29 am

How much of a difference on a SQ Level is/might there be between a MQ430 and a MS275???

Which Also brings me to also further ask.. and possibly jacking a thread here... but kinda curious to know what PG Amp is known for, or folks here have a general consensus of, of having the BEST SQ??? The MS, M, or ZPA Stuff, or something else. IMO the MS amp are the best, but I could be wrong and I think allot of other factors would play a role in that as well.

It has been my understanding the MQ430 is top shelf for SQ, but is it comparable to MS Stuff or just the same? Just curious to know or hear what others think/feel

nutxo · Post by **nutxo** » Thu Mar 20, 2008 12:26 pm

mhyde71 wrote:How much of a difference on a SQ Level is/might there be between a MQ430 and a MS275???

Which Also brings me to also further ask.. and possibly jacking a thread here... but kinda curious to know what PG Amp is known for, or folks here have a general consensus of, of having the BEST SQ??? The MS, M, or ZPA Stuff, or something else. IMO the MS amp are the best, but I could be wrong and I think allot of other factors would play a role in that as well.

It has been my understanding the MQ430 is top shelf for SQ, but is it comparable to MS Stuff or just the same? Just curious to know or hear what other think/feel

I am curious about this also?

Post by **Bfowler** » Thu Mar 20, 2008 12:32 pm

mhyde71 wrote:How much of a difference on a SQ Level is/might there be between a MQ430 and a MS275???

Which Also brings me to also further ask.. and possibly jacking a thread here... but kinda curious to know what PG Amp is known for, or folks here have a general consensus of, of having the BEST SQ??? The MS, M, or ZPA Stuff, or something else. IMO the MS amp are the best, but I could be wrong and I think allot of other factors would play a role in that as well.

It has been my understanding the MQ430 is top shelf for SQ, but is it comparable to MS Stuff or just the same? Just curious to know or hear what others think/feel

mq is just what they named the 4 channel MS's

marko · Post by **marko** » Thu Mar 20, 2008 12:47 pm

my personal favourite for sq is the ms2125, tons of headroom to boot too!

Post by **mhyde71** » Thu Mar 20, 2008 12:48 pm

is that the only 4 channel MS (the mq-430)???

marko · Post by **marko** » Thu Mar 20, 2008 12:59 pm

mhyde71 wrote:is that the only 4 channel MS (the mq-430)???

ms1000 and LE sofas of course...

nutxo · Post by **nutxo** » Thu Mar 20, 2008 1:06 pm

Bfowler wrote:
mhyde71 wrote:How much of a difference on a SQ Level is/might there be between a MQ430 and a MS275???

Which Also brings me to also further ask.. and possibly jacking a thread here... but kinda curious to know what PG Amp is known for, or folks here have a general consensus of, of having the BEST SQ??? The MS, M, or ZPA Stuff, or something else. IMO the MS amp are the best, but I could be wrong and I think allot of other factors would play a role in that as well.

It has been my understanding the MQ430 is top shelf for SQ, but is it comparable to MS Stuff or just the same? Just curious to know or hear what others think/feel

mq is just what they named the 4 channel MS's

I mean. SQ wise how do the different series rate?

Im particularly interested in comparing the M , MS and ZX ( maybe TI ) in order of SQ.

tristan20 · Post by **tristan20** » Thu Mar 20, 2008 1:09 pm

dont forget the ZPAs

Post by **mhyde71** » Thu Mar 20, 2008 1:12 pm

Just splitting hairs here... but if the 4 channels MS's are the MQ's how come the MS1000 is not the MQ1000???

tristan20 · Post by **tristan20** » Thu Mar 20, 2008 1:17 pm

cause the MS1000 isnt a true 4 channel, its actually two ms2250's in one chassis. Its "special" hehe

Post by **mhyde71** » Thu Mar 20, 2008 1:19 pm

Ah Ha ! knew someone would know.. I didnt... makes sense though

but is the 430 the only MQ Amp Produced..?? Suppose I could look on FTP Manual Site but just "dialogging".

nutxo · Post by **nutxo** » Thu Mar 20, 2008 1:31 pm

tristan20 wrote:dont forget the ZPAs

well?

Post by **mhyde71** » Thu Mar 20, 2008 1:34 pm

I have heard the zpa's are basically the same as MS's.. some say better sounding; some say same sound, better looking... not really sure as what an official consensus is or might be about what has the BEST SQ... but maybe we should make a thread for people to chalk votes into or something... MINE is for the MS, but havent ever heard/listened to any ZPA's.

nutxo · Post by **nutxo** » Thu Mar 20, 2008 1:59 pm

mhyde71 wrote:I have heard the zpa's are basically the same as MS's.. some say better sounding; some say same sound, better looking... not really sure as what an official consensus is or might be about what has the BEST SQ... but maybe we should make a thread for people to chalk votes into or something... MINE is for the MS, but havent ever heard/listened to any ZPA's.

Heres my opinion . Its kind of from the outside . I was a fogate guy but Ive been around for a very long time.

To my ear the M, MS and ZX sound damn near identical. ZPA Ive only heard running subs and Ive been of a mind ya dont need the cleanest power to make a sub sounds decent.

I have no opinion on TI and tantrum stuff ( I expect that to be comparable to punch or thunder ). Im pretty interested in what ryval class D amps are like though.

Post by **Bfowler** » Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:22 pm

the TI ans ZX should sound damn near identical also.

in fact, since all these amps (and xenon) have very similar output stages. if you gain matched them, you would be hard pressed to hear the difference in any of them within their power constraints.

1moreamp · Post by **1moreamp** » Thu Mar 20, 2008 6:13 pm

tristan20 wrote:Dont think they made white 430's, I could be wrong though

Tipracer has one in white Original from PG and I saw one in white on e-bay last year... so yes they were a very few made in white.. I say few cause those are the only two I have ever seen in the last 5 or 6 years...

1moreamp · Post by **1moreamp** » Thu Mar 20, 2008 6:28 pm

nutxo wrote:
mhyde71 wrote:I have heard the zpa's are basically the same as MS's.. some say better sounding; some say same sound, better looking... not really sure as what an official consensus is or might be about what has the BEST SQ... but maybe we should make a thread for people to chalk votes into or something... MINE is for the MS, but havent ever heard/listened to any ZPA's.
Heres my opinion . Its kind of from the outside . I was a fogate guy but Ive been around for a very long time.

To my ear the M, MS and ZX sound damn near identical. ZPA Ive only heard running subs and Ive been of a mind ya dont need the cleanest power to make a sub sounds decent.

I have no opinion on TI and tantrum stuff ( I expect that to be comparable to punch or thunder ). Im pretty interested in what ryval class D amps are like though.

All PG M, MS, MPS, MQ, ZX, Ti, Xenon, ZPA, amps are are of the same basic design, so any coincidence in SQ is by design. They all have Triple Darlington output stage design. They all share a common heritage. And they all had to have SQ to be PG from the old days.

I find the ZPA, and Xenon have the right stuff for me SQ wise, But I also own MS-275's and 2125's.
I was building a M-100 from the grave but someone recycled my mint sink.
A lot of people feel the M series was one of the highest SQ amps PG ever made. the M-25 is very impressive. But the channels inside are exact images of the MS-MPS-MQ series, with only the power supply being different in these two series.

So a sound-off for which is best is very subjective, and has been posted about before here on the PG forum, and a few other places on the web.

Nice topic though.....

marko · Post by **marko** » Thu Mar 20, 2008 11:30 pm

Bfowler wrote: if you gain matched them, you would be hard pressed to hear the difference in any of them within their power constraints.

...but in the real world we all crank our systems beyond these levels, this is where the smaller m25 will give out to the mighty ms2125! i do have a soft spot for the m25 as well, there's something about the bottom end of that amp that is so impressive!

tipracer · Post by **tipracer** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 6:28 am

Where do I start...
First, yes pg made white mq-430s i had two(consecutive ser.#'s) until someone made off with one of them(don't worry I still have my original reciept and one day i will catch up with the amp...its to rare to not show up again) I loved them i ran one bridged for my front end and the other ran bridged to the sub(old school kicker solobaric) and the onter two channels to rear fill...i got 133db out of that set up.
second I think that the sound of all the amps mentioned are very close they each have there own plus and minuses
The ms/mq had so much underrated power that they naturally sounded way better than amps of same ratings...and they did sound real good
the m's were just a less expensive version but because they had less coloration they are condsidered a SQ amp(don't be fooled they have still have enough balls to be PG's)
The ZPA's were phoenix's attempt to bring the whole car stereo into one system with everything designed to be used together...from the headunit to the speaker, it was all planned to take over the scene but alas time changed and it became harder and harder to install a quality system into newer cars with all their bells and whistles.
The ZPA's kick ass sound wise....to bad, as mentioned before, most of the time because of the amount of power they put out most people just put them on their subs.
The xenon, Ti and zx all sound very close, they are from my understanding, built with essentially the same topographies...i could be wrong, regardless they too still have the power to be called PG's and asside of some minor problems work well, I think that the only line of any of these that i know of zero problems was the xenons.
Sorry for the long post just my .02
next time-- Why one deck is better than another....

Post by **mhyde71** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 6:54 am

Are xenons considered ol'skool stuff?? Werent they made overseas/after buy out or something.. i dunno so I'm asking.

Pedi · Post by **Pedi** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 7:49 am

In my world, the only real Old-School is the MS/MPS/MQ-series.

Post by **Bfowler** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 10:10 am

marko wrote:
Bfowler wrote: if you gain matched them, you would be hard pressed to hear the difference in any of them within their power constraints.
...but in the real world we all crank our systems beyond these levels, this is where the smaller m25 will give out to the mighty ms2125! i do have a soft spot for the m25 as well, there's something about the bottom end of that amp that is so impressive!

too true...i put the" within their power constraints." part at the end of my post to cover my bases.

i think as long as he is real to himslef about the amount of power he needs, he can't go wrong with any of them

martinkruit · Post by **martinkruit** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 2:00 pm

mhyde71 wrote:How much of a difference on a SQ Level is/might there be between a MQ430 and a MS275???

Which Also brings me to also further ask.. and possibly jacking a thread here... but kinda curious to know what PG Amp is known for, or folks here have a general consensus of, of having the BEST SQ??? The MS, M, or ZPA Stuff, or something else. IMO the MS amp are the best, but I could be wrong and I think allot of other factors would play a role in that as well.

It has been my understanding the MQ430 is top shelf for SQ, but is it comparable to MS Stuff or just the same? Just curious to know or hear what others think/feel

What do you quy's say about the MAC200 SQ wise?????

nutxo · Post by **nutxo** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 2:20 pm

Yall should make a sticky with the comparisons instead of people trying to figure it all out from the manuals

Post by **smgreen20** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 9:26 pm

I like how Errin put it about the ZPAs, ...shinier set of balls.

Look in my signature, that's the quote.