cap?

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nico boom
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Post by nico boom »

Hey Tom; I guess you have a copy of this post, for everytime cap questions are asked... :lol:
I admire you for explaining the matter over, and over, and over, and.......
But one day everybody will know, and cap suppliers will come over to your home, and stone you with all the caps they were nor able to sell anymore! :lol: :lol: :lol:
["let the inoccent man throw the first cap" ]......
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deathcloud
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Post by deathcloud »

I think I used to have insufficient wiring. I had a 4 awg amp kit. But then after all of your guys input I went and upgraded to 0/1 awg because in the long run I might as well do it early and have it ready for future installs if I start to get crazy. Even though I have 0/1 awg and into distro blocks and 4 awg into my amps when I am at 3/4 volume my lights still dim and my amps aren't clipping because they are all set VIA dmm and the clip light doesn't go on. My ground is good, but I don't have a optima yellow top. I don't have the big 3 upgrade which I can maybe assume is maybe the problem. My dad has the big 3 upgrade with 0/1 awg and also has a powercore 15 and gains set via DMM and no dimming at all 3/4 volume. Im envious. But yea I am hoping to get the cap to help with A/C ripple to improve SQ like it did for other people and not to be just a band aid. and also the digital display :P the next thing I'll try to do is to do the big 3 upgrade with 0/1 awg as well and that should really help out i believe.
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drivingdadevil
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Post by drivingdadevil »

Def do the big three upgrade. It made the biggest defferance on my S70. I have the big three upgrade with 0/1 ga and a Kinetic 1400 batt and my lights don't dim at all. BTW I'm running a Ti 500.4 and a Ti 600.2 and even at full vol my voltage doesn't drop pass 13 volts.
Mackenzie
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Post by Mackenzie »

stipud wrote:
blake wrote:I don't have any electrical problems,i was just wondering if i need to use one with my install.I'm using a RSd500.4 and a RSd600.1.
A cap is a great addition to any install where the electrical system is already good enough to sustain input power at the amps. A 1 farad cap offers nearly 20 dB of A/C ripple rejection, meaning you get a clean D/C voltage input into the amp. This means your power supply is less stressed to produce the necessary power, and will translate into an audible improvement in SQ, assuming you have a good enough system to demonstrate it.

Capacitors should not be used as a bandaid for an insufficient charging system. If you drag your alternator down, the cap would discharge in a fraction of a second, and then present a load on your system along with the amp. At this point the cap would only be a parasitic drag, and would not offer any D/C filtering.

Capacitors are electric filters, not batteries.
Where is the proof that it can give you better sq. I hear people saying this all the time, but where are the actual rta measurements on the mic?
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Post by PaulD »

That's the problem with SQ, it's VERY diffcult to quantify.
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Post by blake »

I think i'm gonna start with the big three upgrade before i install anything.Hom much would the big three upgrade run me at a install shop?
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Post by Mackenzie »

blake wrote:I think i'm gonna start with the big three upgrade before i install anything.Hom much would the big three upgrade run me at a install shop?
Unless you want to support your shop, then I would just buy your gear on the web. I got my stuff at http://www.darvex.com/ The soundquest wire is very nice.
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stipud
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Post by stipud »

Mackenzie wrote:Where is the proof that it can give you better sq. I hear people saying this all the time, but where are the actual rta measurements on the mic?
Well, if you know anything about how amps work, it's a no-brainer. Try taking the input caps out of your amp and let me know how it sounds :lol:
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Post by Mackenzie »

stipud wrote:
Mackenzie wrote:Where is the proof that it can give you better sq. I hear people saying this all the time, but where are the actual rta measurements on the mic?
Well, if you know anything about how amps work, it's a no-brainer. Try taking the input caps out of your amp and let me know how it sounds :lol:
But their are no measurements. Where is the proof. Caps are already provided in the amps, so why the need for more? As you can see, this convo will get no where without actual proof. Until I see measurements of a better response on a rta, then its bullshit to me :wink: But if someone wants to buy a cap, then they are entitled to do so. 8) cheers
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thedeal7235
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Post by thedeal7235 »

do u have a cap laying around?, if so, hook it up to ur sub amp(for a day or two) , and listen, see if u notice a difference or not, just a suggestion; remember, in 15 years, I NEVER ONCE USED/TRIED, till recently, and I do notice a difference with it.-mayb sometimes hearing it for yourself , 2 c if u notice, or not, may b the best tests of all-thats why i cant understand , that untill i found this phorum, that the old shop i used up in northern va, never once mentioned the benefits of active vs. passive! oh, i know why now, b/c evryone assumes ur gonna blow shit up all the time, and all they cared/worried about was having to honor warranties-me, as a consumer, have a right to know all options to make best judgement for myself-ill take active, better output-jmho-and, to your caps are already in the amp ?, why did pg supply the le octane with a built in cap? have u ever thought about that?( i think rail voltage) i dont know, i dont care about measurements, can i touch it, hear it, thats how i am, sorry im off my soap box now-
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Post by VW337 »

HoseHead wrote:You don't need a cap because mackenzie said so and mackenzie knows everything about everything because he's a smart guy and we are dumbasses.

His avatar is a fond likeness though. Lips never stop, but nothing comes out.
HH-

Mac is actually right on the button with his statement. You don't need a cap. Tom however has worded it far more eloquently.

A cap is a filter for the most part within the car audio realm.
I think we've established that "Ka Ka" and "Tukki Tukki" don't work.
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Post by KHPower »

I love a cap for its filtering capabilities and i can notice a difference using a 5 farad. too me its like this

With out a cap= the cheap midgrade high ethonol at the gas pump. Your car still runs but it could burn better fuel for better performance of your motor.

With a cap= You are a baller and you only run the good premium fuel which is cleaner and better for the motor and you like performance

The motor being your amplifier and gas/fuel being the power going in :wink:
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thedeal7235
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Post by thedeal7235 »

perfect analogy kh-can we put this thread to bed yet???(hows the 1200.1 working, keeping it up to par, i would imagine :wink:
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KHPower
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Post by KHPower »

thedeal7235 wrote:perfect analogy kh-can we put this thread to bed yet???(hows the 1200.1 working, keeping it up to par, i would imagine :wink:
Why Thank You Christian and yes the 1200.1 on one side of the 15 is working wonders! i can barely breath in my van(which is a good thing IMO)

Thanks 8)
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deathcloud
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Post by deathcloud »

yea I am happy I got a cap that is all that matters. Its not going to do harm at all having it and it looks cool. also the digital display is cool and i will also have RMD at the front of my car so I can see it there too :)
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stipud
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Post by stipud »

Mackenzie wrote:
stipud wrote:
Mackenzie wrote:Where is the proof that it can give you better sq. I hear people saying this all the time, but where are the actual rta measurements on the mic?
Well, if you know anything about how amps work, it's a no-brainer. Try taking the input caps out of your amp and let me know how it sounds :lol:
But their are no measurements. Where is the proof. Caps are already provided in the amps, so why the need for more? As you can see, this convo will get no where without actual proof. Until I see measurements of a better response on a rta, then its bullshit to me :wink: But if someone wants to buy a cap, then they are entitled to do so. 8) cheers
What do you mean there's no measurements? Amps barely work without input capacitance. Having more of it gives you a cleaner input current, which makes your power supply work better. This is why good amps have lots of input capacitance, and cheap Chinese ones only have the bare minimum to make them run without shutting off every second, due to powersupply fluctuations. They also have capacitance on the rail, to keep the voltage clean and stable AFTER the power supply. Both are immensely important in having a good quality amplifier.

You might not hear the difference with an external cap unless you've got a good install, but there is absolutely a difference to the amplifier, unless your DC is ruler-straight already. Go hook up a dual trace oscilloscope to your amp's power inputs and have a look at the DC signal. Now install a cap and tell me how it looks. 20dB noise rejection is awesome :)

I think you guys are getting me wrong. I think every good system should have a cap. I only disagree with their use as a bandaid for an insufficient power system, since in this case it makes things worse. If you've got ample power in your car to feed your amps, then a cap (2 farads or less, low ESR) will do lots of good.
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Post by Stryker »

interesting... i picked up a 5 farad stinger cap,the red one it's called a hybrid,whatever that means. it was cheap 80 buks couldn't say no lol.... i've always ran at least 2 farads in my system not as a bandaid but just to help. i'm sure this one i picked up a couple of weeks ago can't hurt. now to install it along with my brand spankin new 1200.1 RSD:) and the 0 gauge wire thats comin from knukonceptz. it's gettin cold up here tho.
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thedeal7235
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Post by thedeal7235 »

i hope u luv ur rsd 1200.1, but it wont accept 1/o gauge- they barely bore the holes big enuff for 4gauge!!!!!( run the 1/0 gauge to ur distro block, then go 4 gauge out to ur cap-and from there go 4gauge to amps, u know the drill- 8)
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stipud
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Post by stipud »

Stryker wrote:interesting... i picked up a 5 farad stinger cap,the red one it's called a hybrid,whatever that means. it was cheap 80 buks couldn't say no lol.... i've always ran at least 2 farads in my system not as a bandaid but just to help. i'm sure this one i picked up a couple of weeks ago can't hurt. now to install it along with my brand spankin new 1200.1 RSD:) and the 0 gauge wire thats comin from knukonceptz. it's gettin cold up here tho.
Nice! Yes, with 0 gauge your wiring should be sufficient. Just make sure your battery->frame is grounded in 0 gauge as well. And you can use a bit of leftover 4g to run from the battery to the alternator if you haven't already. With that proper power cabling setup, the cap will help your system sound its best.

Those subs are going to do some damage on 1500 watts :lol:
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